veloren VS bevy

I know that code.org's lessons have a "view the real code" box, helping to ease one into the "here's how to think about problems and structure, but here's the actual JavaScript that underpins it". If you haven't tried that, it may help

I also recently learned that Brilliant uses block-based lessons, too, so there's obviously some there-there

I would guess that a lot of the problem is one of actualization: how does one go from solving "someone else's problems" to one of realizing their own ideas. Based on what I've seen, I'd guess that a Minecraft mod port that maps blockly down into lua would go a long way toward "do some things that materialize change in an environment that is familiar." I haven't used Roblox, but I believe it's similar so if they have a programming language, same-same. I started to suggest using Valoren <https://gitlab.com/veloren/veloren#get-veloren> since it's actual FOSS and thus would be much, much easier to integrate into, but I haven't played it in order to know how much uncanny-valley it would have with any preexisting Minecraft experience

Games (Veloren, or check out this website for updates on other games being developed in Rust)

Firstly, it's open-source. That means that all code associated with the project is freely available (it's right here!) and you're welcome to download, modify, recompile, and make changes to it as you wish. In fact, there have already been a few forks of the project that added new items, abilities, bosses, and other such things. Veloren is also released under GPL v3, a license that pretty much ensures that the code will always be open-source, meaning that anybody can take the existing code and remix it, mod it, or otherwise build upon it.

I found this on the gitlab https://gitlab.com/veloren/veloren/-/issues/1755

sounds like a wayland issue, can you check our https://gitlab.com/veloren/veloren/-/issues list and if you dont find this error, you could help us by opening a bug and giving it a good description: Maybe there is even a workaround in our book:

Trying to replace C with something like Rust, is essentially saying that we should rewrite all kernels in Rust. C is the common language because it talks to the kernel, which talks to the hardware.

Forgetting how much would need to be replaced with objectively much slower code, Rust simply cannot do some things. You cannot always make absolute guarantees about memory safety for example when it comes to low-level programming. Sometimes to be fast, you have to make assumptions and take risks.

I am currently watching the Veloron game [1] as an example of how larger Rust projects may begin to look. I see something like this [2] and it doesn't look all dissimilar from C, just with a new syntax. Has writing this game eliminated all bugs? Nope [3]. Maybe there are less segfaults and bad memory management, but this was just one class of bugs.

[1] https://gitlab.com/veloren/veloren

[2] https://gitlab.com/veloren/veloren/-/blob/master/server/src/...

[3] https://gitlab.com/veloren/veloren/-/issues/?sort=closed_des...

Oh dang, looks like it's open source too. licensed under GPLv3 - https://gitlab.com/veloren/veloren

It's really amazing to see how Veloren has improved over the years. Makes me wonder what we'll see in the future. I was really surprised when I saw the train tracks merge request 😄

Bevy. A very young engine where you need to write the game entirely in Rust—that was appealing. But fatal flaws overshadowed everything: no editor, the engine brutally enforces the ECS approach, and the game's architecture must literally bend to fit this paradigm. So, you won't migrate to another engine at all—you just throw away all the code and start from scratch.

Missing one of the best choices as long as "maturity" isn't on the top of your list: Bevy - https://bevyengine.org/

Game engine written in Rust, leveraging ECS in almost every place and way, with a really capable WASM export option. Wrestling ECS for the first time might take you some time, but in my experience helps you keep game code as clean and decoupled as game code could be.

I don't see WASM/WebGPU changing anything when it comes to gaming, as an industry, personally. 3d visualizations and interactive websites? Yeah definitely a nice improvement over WebGL 2, if years late.

WebGPU is pretty far behind what AAA games are using even as of 6 years ago. There's extra overhead and security in the WebGPU spec that AAA games do not want. Browsers do not lend themselves to downloading 300gb of assets.

Additionally, indie devs aren't using Steam for the technical capabilities. It's purely about marketshare. Video games are a highly saturated market. The users are all on Steam, getting their recommendations from Steam, and buying games in Steam sales. Hence all the indie developers publish to Steam. I don't see a web browser being appealing as a platform, because there's no way for developers to advertise to users.

That's also only indie games. AAA games use their own launchers, because they don't _need_ the discoverability from being on Steam. So they don't, and avoid the fees. If anything users _want_ the Steam monopoly, because they like the platform, and hate the walled garden launchers from AAA companies.

(I work on high end rendering features for the Bevy game engine https://bevyengine.org, and have extensive experience with WebGPU)

I was working through an example in the repo for the Bevy game engine recently and came across this code

That's possible. I did spend quite a bit of time tinkering with compiler flags, and followed the recommendations.

Some notes I found just now seems to agree with my results, though: https://github.com/bevyengine/bevy/issues/3978#issuecomment-...

I cannot recommend immediate mode GUI programming based on the limitations I've experienced working with egui.

egui does not support putting two widgets in the center of the screen: https://github.com/emilk/egui/issues/3211

It's really easy to get started with immediate mode, it's really easy to bust out some UI, but the second you start trying to involve dynamically resized context and responsive layouts -- abandon all hope. The fact it has to calculate everything in a single pass makes these things hard/impossible.

... that said, I'm still using it for https://ant.care/ (https://github.com/MeoMix/symbiants) because it's the best thing I've found. I'm crossing my fingers that Bevy's UI story (or Kayak https://github.com/StarArawn/kayak_ui) become significantly more fleshed out sooner rather than later. Bevy 0.13 should have lots more in this area though (https://github.com/bevyengine/bevy/discussions/9538)

I've also been enjoying building My First Game™ in Bevy using ECS. The community around Bevy really shines, but Flecs (https://github.com/SanderMertens/flecs) is arguably a more mature, open-source ECS implementation. You don't get to write in Rust, though, which makes it less cool in my book :)

I'm not very proud of the code I've written because I've found writing a game to be much more confusing than building websites + backends, but, as the author notes, it certainly feels more elegant than OOP or globals given the context.

I'm building for WASM and Bevy's parallelism isn't supported in that context (yet? https://github.com/bevyengine/bevy/issues/4078), so the performance wins are just so-so. Sharing a thread with UI rendering suuucks.

If anyone wants to browse some code or ask questions, feel free! https://github.com/MeoMix/symbiants

These days, some game engines have done pretty well at making compute shaders easy to use (such as Bevy [1] -- disclaimer, I contribute to that engine). But telling the scientific/financial/etc. community that they need to run their code inside a game engine to get a decent experience is a hard sell. It's not a great situation compared to how easy it is on NVIDIA's stack.

[1]: https://github.com/bevyengine/bevy/blob/main/examples/shader...

This is the API you need: https://github.com/bevyengine/bevy/pull/9774