thirdroom
hubs
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thirdroom | hubs | |
---|---|---|
27 | 71 | |
566 | 2,101 | |
2.5% | 0.9% | |
9.1 | 9.6 | |
8 months ago | 5 days ago | |
C | JavaScript | |
Apache License 2.0 | Mozilla Public License 2.0 |
Stars - the number of stars that a project has on GitHub. Growth - month over month growth in stars.
Activity is a relative number indicating how actively a project is being developed. Recent commits have higher weight than older ones.
For example, an activity of 9.0 indicates that a project is amongst the top 10% of the most actively developed projects that we are tracking.
thirdroom
- Croquet: Live, network-transparent 3D gaming
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is there a 3D metaverse, of the fediverse?
Not sure if Mozilla Hubs federates, but as already said, ThirdRoom is Matrix VRchat thing.
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WebXR
you can calculate 2D CSS transforms which match the equivalent transforms of your WebGL scene in WebXR - as an efficient but hacky way to (for instance) do live video overlays in 3D without having to mess around importing the video texture into WebGL (assuming you don’t need occlusion or environmental effects etc).
we’re toying with this as an approach for video overlays in https://thirdroom.io, especially for underpowered devices.
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Rooms.xyz
by “matrix chat 3d like things” do you mean https://thirdroom.io?
It would be super easy to build something like this on Third Room - and then get e2ee and decentralisation etc for free :)
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Google Earth 3D Models Now Available as Open Standard (GlTF)
oh, wow. we have 3D Tile support in https://thirdroom.io but had only ever found NASA’s Mars dataset as a good set of tiles to point it at. This could effectively turn Third Room into a FOSS, decentralised, E2EE multiplayer Google Earth running over Matrix!
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The AT protocol is the most obtuse crock of s*
AT proto has some significant similarities to Matrix:
* Both are work by self-authenticating git-style replication of Merkle trees/DAGs
* Both define strict data schemas for extensible sets of events (Matrix uses JSON schema - https://github.com/matrix-org/matrix-spec/tree/main/data/eve... and OpenAPI; AT uses Lexicons)
* Both use HTTPS for client-server and server-server traffic by default.
* Both are focused on decentralised composable reputation - e.g. https://matrix.org/blog/2020/10/19/combating-abuse-in-matrix... on the Matrix side, or https://paulfrazee.medium.com/the-anti-parler-principles-for... on the bluesky side, etc.
* Both are designed as big-world communication networks. You don't have the server balkanisation that affects ActivityPub.
* Both eschew cryptocurrency systems and incentives.
There are some significant differences too:
* Matrix aspires to be the secure communication layer for the open web.
* AT aspires (i think) to be an open decentralised social networking protocol for the internet.
* AT has portable identity by default. We've been working on this on Matrix (e.g. MSC1228 - https://github.com/matrix-org/matrix-spec-proposals/pull/122... and MSC2787 - https://github.com/matrix-org/matrix-spec-proposals/blob/nei...) and have a new MSC (and implementation on Dendrite) in progress right now which combines the best bits of MSC1228 & MSC2787 into something concrete, at last. In fact the proto-MSC is due to emerge today.
* AT is proposing a asymmetrical federation architecture where user data is stored on Personal Data Servers (PDS), but indexing/fan-out/etc is done by Big Graph Servers (BGS). Matrix is symmetrical and by default federates full-mesh between all servers participating in a conversation, which on one hand is arguably better from a self-sovereignty and resilience perspective - but empirically has created headaches where an underpowered server joins some massive public chatroom and then melts. Matrix has improved this by steady optimisation of both protocol and implementation (i.e. adding lazy loading everywhere - e.g. https://matrix-org.github.io/synapse/latest/development/syna...), but formalising an asymmetrical architecture is an interesting different approach :)
* AT is (today) focused on for public conversations (e.g. prioritising big-world search and indexing etc), whereas Matrix focuses both on private and public communication - whether that's public chatrooms with 100K users over 10K servers, or private encrypted group conversations. For instance, one of Matrix's big novelties is decentralised access control without finality (https://matrix.org/blog/2020/06/16/matrix-decomposition-an-i...) in order to enforce access control for private conversations.
* Matrix also provides end-to-end encryption for private conversations by default, today via Double Ratchet (Olm/Megolm) and in the nearish future MLS (https://arewemlsyet.com). We're also starting to work on post quantum crypto.
* Matrix is obviously ~7 years older, and has many more use cases fleshed out - whether that's native VoIP/Video a la Element Call (https://element.io/blog/introducing-native-matrix-voip-with-...) or virtual worlds like Third Room (https://thirdroom.io) or shared whiteboarding (https://github.com/toger5/TheBoard) etc.
* AT's lexicon approach looks to be a more modular to extend the protocol than Matrix's extensible event schemas - in that AT lexicons include both RPC definitions as well as the schemas for the underlying datatypes, whereas in Matrix the OpenAPI evolves separately to the message schemas.
* AT uses IPLD; Matrix uses Canonical JSON (for now)
* Matrix is perhaps more sophisticated on auth, in that we're switching to OpenID Connect for all authentication (and so get things like passkeys and MFA for free): https://areweoidcyet.com
* Matrix has an open governance model with >50% of spec proposals coming from the wider community these days: https://spec.matrix.org/proposals
* AT has done a much better job of getting mainstream uptake so far, perhaps thanks to building a flagship app from day one (before even finishing or opening up the protocol) - whereas Element coming relatively late to the picture has meant that Element development has been constantly slowed by dealing with existing protocol considerations (and even then we've had constant complaints about Element being too influential in driving Matrix development).
* AT backs up all your personal data on your client (space allowing), to aid portability, whereas Matrix is typically thin-client.
* Architecturally, Matrix is increasingly experimenting with a hybrid P2P model (https://arewep2pyet.com) as our long-term solution - which effectively would end up with all your data being synced to your client. I'd assume bluesky is consciously avoiding P2P having been overextended on previous adventures with DAT/hypercore: https://github.com/beakerbrowser/beaker/blob/master/archive-.... Whereas we're playing the long game to slowly converge on P2P, even if that means building our own overlay networks etc: https://github.com/matrix-org/pinecone
I'm sure there are a bunch of other differences, but these are the ones which pop to the top of my head, plus I'm far from an expert in AT protocol.
It's worth noting that in the early days of bluesky, the Matrix team built out Cerulean (https://matrix.org/blog/2020/12/18/introducing-cerulean) as a demonstration to the bluesky team of how you could build big-world microblogging on top of Matrix, and that Matrix is not just for chat. We demoed it to Jack and Parag, but they opted to fund something entirely new in the form of AT proto. I'm guessing that the factors that went into this were: a) wanting to be able to optimise the architecture purely for social networking (although it's ironic that ATproto has ended up pretty generic too, similar to Matrix), b) wanting to be able to control the strategy and not have to follow Matrix's open governance model, c) wanting to create something new :)
From the Matrix side; we keep in touch with the bluesky team and wish them the best, and it's super depressing to see folks from ActivityPub and Nostr throwing their toys in this manner. It reminds me of the unpleasant behaviour we see from certain XMPP folks who resent the existence of Matrix (e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35874291). The reality is that the 'enemy' here, if anyone, are the centralised communication/social platforms - not other decentralisation projects. And even the centralised platforms have the option of seeing the light and becoming decentralised one day if we play our parts well.
What would be really cool, from my perspective, would be if Matrix ended up being able to help out with the private communication use cases for AT proto - as we obviously have a tonne of prior art now for efficient & audited E2EE private comms and decentralised access control. Moreover, I /think/ the lexicon approach in AT proto could let Matrix itself be expressed as an AT proto lexicon - providing interop with existing Matrix rooms (at least semantically), and supporting existing Matrix clients/SDKs, while using AT proto's ID model and storing data in PDSes etc. Coincidentally, this matches work we've been doing on the Matrix side as part of the MIMI IETF working group to figure out how to layer Matrix on top of other existing protocols: e.g. https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ralston-mimi-matrix-t... and https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ralston-mimi-matrix-m... - and if I had infinite time right now I'd certainly be trying to map Matrix's CS & SS APIs onto an AT proto lexicon to see what it looks like.
TL;DR: I think AT proto is cool, and I wish that open projects saw each other as fellow travellers rather than competitors.
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Server-side physics for a multiplayer game
You could take a look to this project: https://github.com/matrix-org/thirdroom As part of the project they are implementing a web Game engine, uses ThreeJS for graphics, and includes multiplayer using the Matrix protocol. Could be a good starting point.
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We're not really game yet.
Have you looked into what thirdroom or ambient have done in the space?
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Introducing Ambient 0.1: a runtime for building high-performance multiplayer games and 3D applications, powered by Rust, WebAssembly and WebGPU
Have you lot made any friends over at Third Room yet? ;)
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My boss asked me to build a metaverse
If you wanted to be serious about it, you could try to make something based on https://thirdroom.io
hubs
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I Use Firefox
> Firefox Reality on the Oculus Go VR Headset
yes, through not limited to the Oculus
and it kinda folded Hubs (https://hubs.mozilla.com/) into it
and and I think there was a bit of additional research level stuff never ending up in user hands
but both are somewhat dead, idk. if Firefox Reality still works with any VR headset at all (it might still work with non standalone headset usage) and Hubs is shutting down end of March, a community version still exist (Hubs ~= somewhat like VRChat from the idea but not as VR specific and just less interesting in general)
same for most other things they are either dead or fizzled out (and some are stables, but don't bring users, like pdf.js)
One thing I forget to mention is FF does a lot of work to reduce fingerprint-ability of existing interfaces (while trying to avoid breaking websites by changing/breaking existing interfaces, like some other more privacy focused browsers do). A bunch of this is done in context for the tor-browser but also benefit normal FF. Sadly you using FF ads more information to the fingerprint then any of the protections due to better fingerprint protection (something which is true for any form of privacy protection not used en mass by every one).
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Mozilla '23 Ann. Report: CEO pay skyrockets while Firefox Marketshare nosedives
Sounds like they have this huge pile of cash and can't think of a way to improve Firefox with it in any way that seems gee whizz enough.
They tried hopping on Blockchain train and ended up jumping back off after getting roasted by JWZ [0] "we are reviewing if and how our current policy on crypto donations fits with our climate goals. ... [although] decentralized web technology continues to be an important area for us to explore."
I guess AI is gee whizz enough to escape the Planet Burning argument for now.
They had a stab at VR with Mozilla Hubs [1]- and copied off Meta by also not including legs in the avatars! Your personal Hub for only $10 a month. Judging by the code commits it is, er, stable.
Imagine if they put all that effort into innovating the browser.
[0] https://www.theverge.com/2022/1/6/22870787/mozilla-pauses-cr...
[1] https://hubs.mozilla.com/
[2] https://github.com/mozilla/hubs/tree/master/src
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Croquet: Live, network-transparent 3D gaming
Why the comment "This is that rare announcement that's far more significant than it sounds." In El Reg, which is usually rather skeptical. Am I missing something?
[1] https://hubs.mozilla.com
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is there a 3D metaverse, of the fediverse?
Not sure if Mozilla Hubs federates, but as already said, ThirdRoom is Matrix VRchat thing.
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Exploring Imaginary Worlds
Neal Stephenson's novel Snow Crash introduced the concept of the Metaverse, a virtual reality universe accessible to all used for gaming, work, and socializing. The Metaverse-as we might know it in real life-is a virtual world being built by a variety of companies, including Facebook, Microsoft, and Sony. This visionary idea has influenced the development of open source virtual reality platforms like Mozilla Hubs. Many of the OSS projects inspired by Snow Crash create immersive and collaborative virtual spaces that can be explored, built upon, and customized by users.
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frameworks - aframe vs babylon vs others?
Is it not? https://github.com/mozilla/hubs
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[Valve Index] Comment utiliser mon index de soupape lorsque j'essaie d'accéder aux expériences VR de mon navigateur?
Comme: https://hubs.mozilla.com/
- A moment’s silence, please, for the death of Mark Zuckerberg’s metaverse. Meta sank tens of billions into its CEO’s virtual reality dream, but what will he do next? [Opinion]
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Hey! I've created a tool for our remote team to put every video call in a virtual environment. What do you think? The main idea is that regular zoom meetings are super boring and it's hard to make a 10 person team stay engaged..
Looks similar to the existing FLOSS Mozilla Hubs :) https://hubs.mozilla.com/
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I've Found New Love in an Old GearVR Headset - Help me Find More!
Mozilla hubs just use your browser
What are some alternatives?
pinecone - Peer-to-peer overlay routing for the Matrix ecosystem
unity-webxr-export - Assets for creating WebXR-enabled Unity3D projects.
openjpeg - Official repository of the OpenJPEG project
A-Frame - :a: Web framework for building virtual reality experiences.
Ambient - The multiplayer game engine
mozilla-hubs-docker - Docker based developing environment for Mozilla Hubs.
webxr - Repository for the WebXR Device API Specification.
vircadia-content - Vircadia Content repo
thirdroom-unity-exporter
workadventure - A collaborative web application (virtual office) presented as a 16-bit RPG video game
jpeg2000-decoder - Decodes JPEG 2000 images in a subprocess, for safety
reticulum - Phoenix web server for hubs.mozilla.com