qubes-mirage-firewall VS seL4

2) https://github.com/mirage/qubes-mirage-firewall is by far a better firewall for Qubes than OpenBSD ever will be - unikernels are far more secure than a traditional operating system is and you can read all about it on https://mirageos.org/

That's correct. It does mean that the closest to a self-contained program you can run is a unikernel like the mirage-firewall, unfortunately. On the upside, those remain easily portable to essentially anything that can run VMs so long as you adjust the image format.

That sounds similar to a unikernel. There are actual uses for those in seL4 and Qubes OS such as a firewall-qube (in theory unikernel qubes should be able to take far less system resources to run than full Linux+distro qubes).

Here's one that is "production" ready: the Mirage-Firewall microkernel running on Qubes OS.[0]

[0] : https://github.com/mirage/qubes-mirage-firewall

sys-net, sys-firewall and other administrative vms should slowly migrate to unikernels instead of running linux, which should help with ram usage. The mirage.io project seems to build a couple qubes vms, for example https://github.com/mirage/qubes-mirage-firewall is a firewall which they indicate to give 64Mb of ram.

> People like to snob Unix but the fact is: the world runs on Unix.

The world you are aware of runs on it.

> Can we really do that much better or is it just hubris?

Yes. Have a look at seL4[1] and Barrelfish too[2], even though that's no longer active. seL4 in particular is powering a lot of highly secure computing systems. There is a surprisingly large sphere outside of Unix/POSIX.

[1] https://sel4.systems/

[2] https://barrelfish.org/

There are also RTOS-capable microkernels such as seL4[0], with few but extremely fast syscalls[1]. Note times are in cycles, not usec.

0. https://sel4.systems/

1. https://sel4.systems/About/Performance/

https://sel4.systems

Working on a number of platforms, verified on some. Multicore support is an ongoing effort afaict.

On OS built on this kernel is still subject to some assumptions (like, hardware working correctly, bootloader doing its job, etc). But mostly those assumptions are less of a problem / easier to prove than the properties of a complex software system.

As I understand it, guarantees that seL4 does provide, go well beyond anything else currently out there.

Take a look at this: https://sel4.systems/

It's probably have to be seL4 (https://sel4.systems), running on some fully OSS hardware.

There are question marks over much of available RISC-V chips due to chinese producers, so maybe OpenPower based hardware?

Plus, the entire system (motherboard, etc) would need to be manufactured using a good supply chain.

Hmmm, this has probably all been thought through in depth before by others. :)

You can use it to (mostly) validate small snippets are the same. See Alive2 for the application of Z3/formalization of programs as SMT for that [1]. As far as I'm aware there are some problems scaling up to arbitrarily sized programs due to a lack of formalization in higher level languages in addition to computational constraints. With a lot of time and effort it can be done though [2].

1. https://github.com/AliveToolkit/alive2

2. https://sel4.systems/

Formal methods. This is not in most general-purpose programming languages and probably never will be (maybe we'll see formal methods to verify unsafe code in Rust...) because it's a ton of boilerplate (you have to help the compiler type-check your code) and also extremely complicated. However, formal methods is very important for proving code secure, such as sel4 (microkernel formally verified to not have bugs or be exploitable) which has just received the ACM Software Systems Award 3 days ago.

Today we'd look at seL4.