schema
clog
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schema | clog | |
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9 | 150 | |
2,380 | 1,419 | |
0.0% | - | |
0.0 | 9.2 | |
about 1 year ago | 6 days ago | |
Clojure | Common Lisp | |
GNU General Public License v3.0 or later | GNU General Public License v3.0 or later |
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For example, an activity of 9.0 indicates that a project is amongst the top 10% of the most actively developed projects that we are tracking.
schema
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Tired by the dynamicism
Plumatic schema (https://github.com/plumatic/schema) , or friends I might be wrong, but I think schema might make more sense to you coming from the F# world (might be wrong)
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Clojure from a Schemer's perspective
This one? I didn't. I hear good things about it, and it's reached a point of maturity, being widely used in production.
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Worrying comment from HN on Building a Startup on Clojure
Uhhh spec has existed for a long time and before that, schema Nowadays we also have the excellent malli. If his codebase is full of functions where the shape of the data isn’t obvious, isn’t documented and isn’t specified in a specific/schema, that’s on him and his bad coding practices and really no different from passing data in other dynamic languages. A class by itself (without additional effort) only gives you field names.
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Building a Startup on Clojure
I don't understand this reputation either. There are very large systems built on other Lisps. For example, Emacs has a massive amount of Elisp. Elisp is much more primitive than Clojure, and traditionally libraries don't use e.g. data schemas [1] as runtime contracts for data.
Obviously, once a system built on top of a dynamic language grows beyond certain threshold, you need to be very disciplined as there are no static types to ensure some degree of correctness.
[1] https://github.com/plumatic/schema
- Clojure needs a Rails, but not for the reason you think
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General anxiety regarding learning Clojure and such
Try to learn a schema library early, like Malli or Prismatic Schema. Do not mistook them as "static-typing" things - it's more for data validation and coercion than "security that things will get the right typing information". The idea to learn them early is how you'll shape future code: validating all "output data" first, them using that data inside your program without "defensive programming" like checking every time if a specific value on a map is nil, etc
- Six years of professional Clojure development
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What are some great Clojure libraries, as of 2021?
In Clojure, declarative data specifications for validation and generation are also very mainstream. Schema was first out the door, Clojure Spec is the most popular library, while malli is gaining popularity fast at the moment.
clog
- Embracing Common Lisp in the Modern World
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Use any web browser as GUI, with Zig in the back end and HTML5 in the front end
Reminds me of the approach of CLOG (Common Lisp Omnificent Gui[1]) and its ancestor GNOGA (The GNU Omnificent GUI for Ada[2]).
They also integrate basic components and even graphical UI editor (at least for CLOG), so you can essentially develop the whole thing from inside CL or Ada
[1] https://github.com/rabbibotton/clog
[2] https://github.com/alire-project/gnoga
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Common Lisp: An Interactive Approach (1992) [pdf]
For me David Botton [0] with his work including code, support and videos is doing very nice work in this direction.
I use SBCL for everything but work because I cannot get; we are getting there, but like you say, it’s such a nice experience working interactively building fast that it is magic and it’s painful returning to my daily work of Python and typescript/react. It feels like a waste of time/life, really.
[0] https://github.com/rabbibotton/clog
- CLOG - The Common Lisp Omnificent GUI
- Clog The Common Lisp Omnificent GUI
- Clog – The Common Lisp Omnificent GUI
- Tkinter Designer: Quickly Turn Figma Design to Python Tkinter GUI
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Want to learn lisp?
I was following along on the Windows page and didn't check back on the main README to see if any of the other instructions would help.
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All Web frontend lisp projects
It the answer is "latter", then you could look at Common Lisp and Reblocks (https://40ants.com/reblocks/) or CLOG (https://github.com/rabbibotton/clog).
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How to Understand and Use Common Lisp
I haven't used Clojure professionally in 10 years so with a grain of salt here are my thoughts as only one other person answered...
CL over Clojure: it's the OG Lisp that the creator of Clojure used and wanted to continue using but faced too much resistance from management afraid of anything not-Java/not-Oracle, or not-CLR/not-Microsoft, etc. Clojure shipped originally as "just another jar" so devs could "sneak" it in. If you don't have such a management restriction, why Clojure? If you want to integrate CL with the JVM, you can use the ABCL implementation, there's also something from one of the proprietary Lisps. Some useful CL features that are nice in this domain: conditions and restarts mentioned in a sibling comment (very nice to help interactively develop/debug e.g. a selenium webdriver test), ability to easily compile an exe (perhaps useful for microservices, or just to keep your deployment environment clean and not having to care about Lisp), and ability to easily ship with an open local socket allowing you to SSH in (or SSH port forward) and debug/fix/poke around in production (JVM of course lets you attach debuggers to a running process, even certain billion+ dollar companies will have supervised/limited prod debugging sessions for various hairy cases, but it's not as interactive). You should never hear CL advocates claim you can't scale to large teams/groups of engineers or large multi-million-lines sized projects, though you might oddly hear Clojure advocates sometimes claim you can't (and shouldn't) scale to such large projects -- large groups of engineers are a non-issue for them as well though, the challenge is in hiring, not in the language somehow making it impossible to modularize and keep people from stepping on each other.
Clojure over CL: its integration with the JVM is nicer than ABCL's, so if you do actually want a lot of the great world of Java stuff, it's easier to get at. Database integration libraries are better. Access to libs (Clojure or Java) is via Maven, so it's a larger ecosystem with more self-integrating components (especially around monitoring/metrics) than what's available for Lisp via Quicklisp. Clojure is very opinionated, much of it quite tasteful, and that gives the whole ecosystem a certain consistency. (You can have immutable data structures in CL, you can if you want use [] for literal vectors and make them syntactically important e.g. in let bindings, but not everyone will be on board.) Even though its popularity seems to have stopped growing, at least at the same rate as e.g. Go which it was keeping pace with for a while, it's still popular enough with a bigger community; as a proxy measure there are multiple conferences around the world and good talks at adjacent conferences, whereas Lisp mostly just has one conference in Europe per year and only occasional branching outside of that.
If you're doing a client-side-heavy webapp, ClojureScript is still amazing, CL's answers there aren't very compelling with the exception of CLOG (https://github.com/rabbibotton/clog) which takes an entirely different direction than the usual idea of translating/running Lisp on top of JavaScript and its popular frameworks.
What are some alternatives?
malli - High-performance data-driven data specification library for Clojure/Script.
kandria - A post-apocalyptic actionRPG. Now on Steam!
clj-kondo - Static analyzer and linter for Clojure code that sparks joy
stumpwm - The Stump Window Manager
specter - Clojure(Script)'s missing piece
awesome-cl - A curated list of awesome Common Lisp frameworks, libraries and other shiny stuff.
matcher-combinators - Library for creating matcher combinator to compare nested data structures
electron-sbcl-sqlite - A simple boilerplate that builds an Electron app with SBCL and SQLite3 embedded
clojure-dsl-resources - A curated list of Clojure resources for dealing with domain-specific languages.
weblocks - This fork was created to experiment with some refactorings. They are collected in branch "reblocks".
fulcro - A library for development of single-page full-stack web applications in clj/cljs
kons-9 - Common Lisp 3D Graphics Project