terra VS lean4

Chapel has at least several full-time developers at Cray/HPE and (I think) the US national labs, and has had some for almost two decades. That's much more than $100k.

Chapel is also just one of many other projects broadly interested in developing new programming languages for "high performance" programming. Out of that large field, Chapel is not especially related to the specific ideas or design goals of Mojo. Much more related are things like Codon (https://exaloop.io), and the metaprogramming models in Terra (https://terralang.org), Nim (https://nim-lang.org), and Zig (https://ziglang.org).

But Chapel is great! It has a lot of good ideas, especially for distributed-memory programming, which is its historical focus. It is more related to Legion (https://legion.stanford.edu, https://regent-lang.org), parallel & distributed Fortran, ZPL, etc.

Terra is the language you're looking for: https://terralang.org/

Wow, amazing stuff. I love Lua, it was how I learned programming as a kid. Coincidently from the same world as the author. Open Tibia.

The author made a custom client (https://github.com/edubart/otclient) for the game that is still very much in active use by thousands of players. He's a very skilled developer.

Great to see AOT typed Lua, I know of the other solutions: Luau, Teal, TypeScriptToLua, Terra, etc., but this one is my favorite so far.

Love the simple compilation to C (and WASM support via Emscripten). Though Terra's JIT is enticing and good replacement for LuaJIT, this is for embedded systems, it's a good replacement for Lua PUC-Rio.

The World:

- https://luau-lang.org/

- https://terralang.org/

- https://github.com/teal-language/tl

- https://typescripttolua.github.io/

Terra is a language that can also do that, and uses Lua as the metaprogramming language. Types are just Lua values.

But unfortunately, there's a lot of work left kind of half-baked so using the language is a pain... if someone invested a lot of time to make Terra work properly and added some tooling around it, wrote proper docs and so on, it would be a really interesting language.

https://terralang.org/

(I am slightly familiar with a language called Terra (https://terralang.org), which couples C with Lua, where the Lua is basically used as the metaprogramming layer ... sort of like comptime in Zig. And making an SOA data structure is the kind of thing you could do in Lua in Terra. So that was partly the basis for my question).

> why can't the hardware designer do something simple and clean

If it was easy, it would not need firmware in the first place. Firmware is there because people expect certain features and quality of life. See softmodems.

> write some assembly (without abusing the assembler preprocessor...)

You want https://terralang.org/ and not "just C"/"just Assembler" instead ?

Lean is free and open source and nothing to do with MS. Check out https://lean-lang.org/ and https://github.com/leanprover/lean4 -- no mention of MS or MSR (where de Moura was where he developed Lean 3 and started on Lean 4).

Recently replaced by Lean, though.

https://github.com/cedar-policy/cedar-spec

https://lean-lang.org

Nice read! Rust has pushed, and will continue to push, the limits of practical, bare metal, memory safe languages. And it's interesting to think about what's next, maybe eventually there will be some form of practical theorem proving "for the masses". Lean 4 looks great and has potential, but it's still mostly a language for mathematicians. There has been some research on AI constructed proofs, which could be the best of both worlds because then the type checker can verify that the AI generated code/proof is indeed correct. Tools like Kani are also a step forward in program correctness.

Yeah, I believe they said intend for it to be used as a general purpose programming language. I used it to complete Advent of Code last year.

There are some really interesting features for general purpose programming in there. For example: you can code updates to arrays in a functional style (change a value, get a new array back), but if the refcount is 1, it updates in place. This works for inductive types and structures, too. So I was able to efficiently use C-style arrays (O(1) update/lookup) while writing functional code. (paper: https://arxiv.org/abs/1908.05647 )

Another interesting feature is that the "do" blocks include mutable variables and for loops (with continue / break / return), that gets compiled down to monad operations. (paper: https://dl.acm.org/doi/10.1145/3547640 )

And I'm impressed that you can add to the syntax of the language, in the same way that the language is implemented, and then use that syntax in the next line of code. (paper: https://lmcs.episciences.org/9362/pdf ). There is an example in the source repository that adds and then uses a JSX-like syntax. (https://github.com/leanprover/lean4/blob/master/tests/playgr... )

My latest inspiration to use code to a) replace my video editor, b) learn the basics of EDM production and c) understand a few topics in higher maths. This might sound very strange given there are specialised tools for these jobs. There's iMovie / Adobe Premier for video, there's GarageBand and FL studio for music and old good pen and pencil for math proofs. But these tools have three big limitations. First they have a lot of idiosyncratic learning, you have to spend quite some time getting used to these tools and my experience is that this time is quite upsetting. In contrast, you only have to learn to code one, maybe spend a few hours getting used to the syntax of another language. I'm not sure if that's true for most people but it was true for me using the tools mentioned above and wanted a place to discuss and see other people ideas and experiments. The second issue is that all these custom-made tools, are not composing easily. I can't search for all math proofs that used a single theorem. I can't create a plugin for iMovie and apply it to all my videos. I can't pick easily pick a rhythm from the internet and build upon for fun. There's also the issue of costs and version control, all tools I'm using today are open source and my work is stored in my repositories. This way I can create branches and test my ideas and I'm also confident that I can work in these projects in years.