nogil VS kivy

This might be a dumb question, but why would removing the GIL break FFI? Is it just that existing no-GIL implementations/proposals have discarded/ignored it, or is there a fundamental requirement, e.g. C programs unavoidably interact directly with the GIL? I know that the C-API is only stable between minor releases [0] compiled in the same manner [1], so it's not like the ecosystem is dependent upon it never changing.

I cannot seem to find much discussion about this. I have found a no-GIL interpreter that works with numpy, scikit, etc. [2][3] so it doesn't seem to be a hard limit. (That said, it was not stated if that particular no-GIL implementation requires specially built versions of C-API libs or if it's a drop-in replacement.)

[0]: https://docs.python.org/3/c-api/stable.html#c-api-stability

[1]: https://docs.python.org/3/c-api/stable.html#platform-conside...

[2]: https://github.com/colesbury/nogil

[3]: https://discuss.python.org/t/pep-703-making-the-global-inter...

https://github.com/colesbury/nogil does manage to get rid of the GIL, but it's not certain to make it into Python core. The main problem is the amount of existing libraries that depend on the existence of the GIL without realizing it - breaking those would be extremely disruptive.

CPython is also investigating the removal of the GIL (PEP703, nogil). I think requiring the GIL is a wider thing that libraries will need to address anyway. But also, for the same reason as above I'd be surprised if the Modular team thought that saying "you can run all your python code unchanged" was a good idea if there was a secret "except for code that uses numpy" muttered under the breath.

I'm worried about the speedup

My understanding is that it's based on the most recent attempt to remove the GIL by Sam Gross

https://github.com/colesbury/nogil

In addition to some ways to try to not have nogil have as much overhead he added a lot of unrelated speed improvements so that python without the gil would still be faster not slower in single thread mode. They seem to have merged those performance patches first that means if they add his Gil removal patches in say python 3.12 it will still be substantially slower then 3.11 although faster then 3.10. I hope that doesn't stop them from removing the gil (at least by default)

Looks like it's still active to me:

https://github.com/colesbury/nogil/

We will create this complete Python registration form using Kivy. We get started by installing Kivy, a powerful Python framework for building interactive applications.

For reference, YouTube runs on Python[1,2,3]:

> 1. Python and Django: YouTube’s backend is predominantly written in Python, offering a balance of performance and readability.

> 2. Google Cloud Platform...

> 3. Java and C++: YouTube also utilizes Java and C++ for specific backend services, as they provide better performance for certain tasks.

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A long time ago, I looked into these Python frameworks:

- http://www.web2py.com/

- https://kivy.org/

[1]: https://blogopost.com/youtube-tech-stack/#backend

[2]: https://medium.com/@shanthanaroja99/technology-stack-behind-...

[3]: https://youtu.be/G-lGCC4KKok

I have a multi-threaded app using Kivy for the GUI and sometimes need to update the GUI from a background thread. This app is a few years old and I recently updated to Kivy 2.2 and am now getting an exception with the message "Cannot create graphics instruction outside the main Kivy thread" -- which is related to this change in Kivy 2.1: https://github.com/kivy/kivy/pull/7270

I suggest you use kivy which is suitable for the desktop but also has the advantage of being one of few options for creating Python based native(ish) mobile apps (for IoS and Android app stores).

I think the best one right now for python is "beeware": https://beeware.org/

You also have Kivy which is prety good: https://kivy.org/

Anyone has some experience with Kivy [1]? It seems that it checks off some of my requirements, like cross-platform, supporting touch interfaces, ease of development, allows complex/fancy UIs as well, etc.

[1] https://kivy.org/

There are hot reload tools like kivy.tools.kviewer and KivyMD HotReload and I think others... but maybe they used something else, hard to tell

Notable Projects: Kivy ( https://kivy.org/ )

My name is Mathieu Virbel, and I am a consultant on system and software architecture with over 12 years of experience as a freelance and 20 years in the field. I have a passion for creating innovative and user-friendly applications. I specialize in using the open-source Kivy framework to develop desktop and mobile applications, but I am also skilled in other technologies and frameworks.

SEEKING WORK | France (UTC-1) | Remote | Full stack developer

My name is Mathieu Virbel, and I am a consultant on system and software architecture with over 12 years of experience as a freelance and 20 years in the field. I have a passion for creating innovative and user-friendly applications. I specialize in using the open-source Kivy framework to develop desktop and mobile applications, but I am also skilled in other technologies and frameworks.

I worked on a variety of subjects, from Interactives and mobile application for Museum and Public Institutions, Embedded system in security company, telecommunication, and Startups environments from scratch. Recently playing with Python, Golang, VueJS 3/Typescript, InfluxDB, Docker Swarm, as well as writing specifications and reviewing code of others contractors.

Technologies: Python (django, flask, tensorflow, Kivy, …), Golang, TypeScript, VueJS, Quasar, Docker, Docker Swarm, Terraform, Ansible, MongoDB, InfluxDB, MariaDB, SQLite, Kafka, Prometheus/Graphana

Résumé/CV: https://meltingrocks.com/cv

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mathieuvirbel/

Website: https://meltingrocks.com

Email: [email protected]

Notable Projects: Kivy ( https://kivy.org/ )