liblinux VS linux

> libc isn't really getting in the way here.

For the standard set of system calls, the libc is pretty great. For Linux-specific features, it could take years for glibc to gain support. Perhaps it's gotten better since then, perhaps it still takes years. I don't know.

Years ago I read about the tale of the getrandom system call and the quest to get glibc to support it:

https://lwn.net/Articles/711013/

A kernel hacker wrote in an email:

> maybe the kernel developers should support a libinux.a library that would allow us to bypass glibc when they are being non-helpful

That made a lot of sense to me. I took that concept and kind of ran with it. Started a liblinux project, essentially a libc with nothing but the thinnest possible system call wrappers. Researched quite a bit about glibc's attitude towards Linux to justify it:

https://github.com/matheusmoreira/liblinux#why

Eventually I discovered Linux was already doing the same thing with their own nolibc.h file which they were already using in their own tools. It was a single file back then, by now it's become a sprawling directory full of code:

https://github.com/torvalds/linux/tree/master/tools/include/...

Even asked Greg Kroah-Hartman on reddit about it once:

https://old.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/fx5e4v/im_greg_kroah...

Since the kernel was developing their own awesome headers, I decided to drop liblinux and start lone instead. :)

It gives you access to 100% of Linux's system calls. It eliminates a lot of global state. It gets rid of a lot of legacy libc crap.

Years ago I wrote a fairly referenced rationale in my liblinux project:

https://github.com/matheusmoreira/liblinux/blob/master/READM...

> Now, do I think it would make total sense for syscall wrappers and NSS to be split into their own libs (or dbus interfaces maybe) with stable ABIs to enable other libc's, absolutely!

I worked on this a few years ago: liblinux.

https://github.com/matheusmoreira/liblinux

I'm not developing it anymore though because I found out the Linux kernel itself has a superior nolibc library:

https://github.com/torvalds/linux/tree/master/tools/include/...

It used to be a single header but it looks like they've recently organized it into a proper project!

I wonder if it will become some kind of official kernel library at some point. I asked Greg Kroah-Hartman about this and he mentioned there was once a klibc:

https://old.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/fx5e4v/im_greg_kroah...

> This is something the BSD's got absolutely right.

BSDs, every other operating system really, force us to use the bundled C libraries and the C ABI. I think Linux's approach is better. It has a language-agnostic system call binary interface: it's just a simple calling convention and the system call instruction.

The right place for system call support is the compiler. We should have system_call keywords that cause it to emit code in the aforementioned calling convention. With this single keyword, it's possible to do program literally anything on Linux. Wrappers for every specific system call should be part of every language's standard library with language-specific types and semantics.

I'm not using this stuff professionally, it's just my own home lab's virtual machines with little services implemented as freestanding C programs. Not doing anything fancy right now, much of it was just to see if I could do it.

I've seen other people commenting here on HN saying they're using the same approach so it's defenitely not my invention.

I published some of my work in the form of a liblinux that I use to make system calls:

https://github.com/matheusmoreira/liblinux

I'm not developing it anymore though because I found out the kernel itself has a nolibc library:

https://github.com/torvalds/linux/tree/master/tools/include/...

It used to be a single header but it looks like they've organized it into a proper project.

That's awesome. I didn't know about rwildcard until now. Is it part of GMSL? I searched for rwildcard on gmsl.sourceforge.io but didn't find it.

I think my function is needlessly complicated compared to rwildcard. Here's my code:

https://github.com/matheusmoreira/liblinux/blob/modular-buil...

https://github.com/matheusmoreira/liblinux/blob/modular-buil...

The file? and directory? functions were inspired by GMSL.

I wrote a general recursion function. It takes a function to apply to lists and a function to compute whether an element is a base case.

The recursive file system traversal function applies a directory globbing function to the list of paths and has file? as base case.

The find function filters out any items not matching a given predicate function. It was my intention to provide predicates like C_file? and header_file? but I stopped developing that project before that happened.

I think rwildcard is probably simpler and more efficient!

FFS predates FreeBSD and is in some capacity supported by all 3 major BSDs. I'm fairly confident that Linux actually supports it through the ufs driver ( https://github.com/torvalds/linux/tree/master/fs/ufs ); whether the use of different names in different places makes it better or worse is an exercise for the reader.

These are a bit easier to see what's going on:

https://github.com/torvalds/linux/commit/d5cf50dafc9dd5faa1e...

https://github.com/torvalds/linux/blob/d5cf50dafc9dd5faa1e61...

Unfortunately Github doesn't have a way to render symbols for whitespace, but you can tell by selecting the spaces that the previous version had leading tabs. Linus changed it so that the tokens `default` and the number e.g. `12` are also separated by a tab. This is tricky, because the token "default" is seven characters, it will always give this added tab a width of 1 char which makes it always layout the same as if it were a space no matter if you use tab widths of 1, 2, 4, or 8.

There was also a Gentoo effort to run atop FreeBSD[0]. The challenge of course is that afaik none of the BSD kernel ABIs are considered stable. The stable interface is the BSD libc. That said, with binfmt_misc, I don't see a reason you couldn't just run (at least some) FreeBSD binaries on Linux with a thin syscall translation layer (rather something like qemu-system) and then your layer hooked via binfmt_misc. I'm not aware of anyone who has done this for FreeBSD, but prior efforts existed as alternate binfmts for SysVr4/5 ELF binaries[2]. Either way would take some elbow grease, but you *might* even be able just reuse binfmt_elf and just have a new interpreter for FreeBSD elf.

[0] https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Gentoo_FreeBSD

[1] https://docs.kernel.org/admin-guide/binfmt-misc.html

[2] https://github.com/torvalds/linux/blob/master/fs/binfmt_elf....

> The original less-than check was deemed incorrect

It was only deemed incorrect because of an information leak. Not because it's a valid use-case for user space to copy smaller portions of *hwrpb into user space. https://github.com/torvalds/linux/commit/21c5977a836e399fc71...

Correct. And the combined work needs to carry the MIT license text and copyright attributions for the MIT software authors. With binary distribution it must also be overt, not hidden in some source code drop, but directly accompanying the binary.

Many people who talk about relicensing never credit the MIT developers or distribute the MIT license text. "Because it's GPL now."

I don't think that you believe that, but many developers do.

Some don't see the need for source code scans for Open Source compliance, because the license.txt says GPL, so it's GPL. Prime example is the Linux kernel. There is code under different licenses in there, but people don't even read https://github.com/torvalds/linux/blob/master/COPYING till the end ("In addition, other licenses may also apply.") and conclude it's simply GPL 2 and nothing else.

Also be aware that sublicensing is not the same as relicensing.

> Does he have something against it?

He notoriously hates GNU Emacs, yes.

https://marc.info/?m=122955159617722

https://github.com/torvalds/linux/blob/master/Documentation/...

So If we would only count code and not comments, it is only 9489 LoC Rust. Which would be about 0.03% and if we take all lines and not only LoC it would be around 0.05%

[0] https://github.com/XAMPPRocky/tokei

[1] https://github.com/torvalds/linux/commit/b401b621758e46812da...

AIUI fsync is built on futex_waitv which has been upstreamed. So this has to be more than that.

https://github.com/torvalds/linux/commit/a0eb2da92b715d0c97b...