ada-spark-rfcs VS rust-dominator

Original discussion was there, I guess you can post your comments to that PR to keep the discussion in one place.

I forgot where I saw it, but I do recall reading somewhere that the ARG had discussed whether a shorter revision cycle would be better or not. I wouldn't be surprised if the creation of this ( https://github.com/AdaCore/ada-spark-rfcs ) was inspired by that discussion.

Ada might be getting pattern matching soon too:

https://github.com/AdaCore/ada-spark-rfcs/blob/master/protot...

> I did some ADA in the past and yes, it is a nice language, but it lacks the modernity and a dynamic community like Rust. ADA did received some nice update to its specification, but, just like C++, it struggle / cannot really fit the latest innovation in programming language that easily.

I'm still learning both Ada and Rust, nevertheless I humbly disagree. The more I learn it and other "old" languages the more it looks to me like "modern" ones rediscover things that have been present in other languages for years.

The really significant difference I can see for now is that Ada is not focused so strongly on functional programming paradigm. Rust borrow checker is a strong success of course and was another significant difference, but latest SPARK got borrow checking capabilities too, AFAIK.

While Ada's open-source community is smaller, I find it as energetic and devoted to improving the ecosystem as Rust's. I have no idea about closed-source community, but in the past 4 years ArianeGroup [1], Airbus [2] and Nvidia [3] talked about choosing Ada for their high-integrity applications.

> And to be fair, it is fine. ADA is very much a "committee" language (its spec are ISO/IEC) instead of a "community" language (all the spec and rfc of Rust are on github and anyone can easily discuss them).

You can discuss Ada/SPARK RFCs here: https://github.com/AdaCore/ada-spark-rfcs . I think I once saw on Ada forum or chat that someone proposing changes to the language was simply invited to talk to people working on the standard, so it doesn't look like the language is developed in isolation or something.

> This makes it so that ADA doesn't get the attention, and the rapidity of innovation, that a language like Rust does, but ADA is mostly made for program that will need to be maintained in critical operations for decades with the code being maintainable and compilable far into the future.

I think that Ada adopted quiet quickly to standards set by Rust: lower entry barrier toolchain, compelling licensing, library distribution, RFCs, etc. And in terms of language features, in many areas it's not only on par, but ahead of competition. So you're less likely to see lots of changes, but they do happen nevertheless. I'm not saying Ada is perfect, of course. There are parts of it that other languages do better. No shame in that.

IMHO, the reason Ada is unknown to many people is a combination of its past, myths surrounding it, and general trend of people to follow trends. ;) But I currently find Ada/SPARK even more compelling option than Rust, even though I like both.

[1] https://www.facebook.com/ArianeGroup/posts/2872955946126067

There's a proposal to allow dot syntax for untagged types as well.

There's also an active discussion about adding format strings to the language here: https://github.com/AdaCore/ada-spark-rfcs/pull/77

They are both async and made for GUI -- in case of rust-signals WebGUI, provided by dominator and MoonZoon.

You shouldn’t ever need to deal with OsString itself on wasm32-unknown-unknown, since that target basically just doesn’t cover functionality that needs it, but the actual situation is genuinely worse than OsString: Rust insists on valid Unicode (as is right and proper), but the web suffers from the affliction of ill-formed UTF-16. If you blindly convert from JavaScript strings to Rust strings, you will encounter data and functionality loss in a few situations, in practice always involving IME (or similar) text entry on Windows. The first bug I filed about this: https://github.com/Pauan/rust-dominator/issues/10, and you can follow further links if you’re interested. IE and Edge used to be largely immune to this, but IE is dead and I suppose Edge will have regressed in this way with the Chromium migration, since the bug filed in Chromium a few years ago <https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=949056> has languished. (Firefox too, with <https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1541349>.) In the worst-case scenario, careless use like was the case in rust-dominator will mean that some users typing with particular software in a language that’s outside the Basic Multilingual Plane will not be able to type anything.

One comparison I'm missing , which I think provides quite a nice solution in Rust, is the signals based approach popularized by Solid JS and implemented in Rust by sycamore and earlier by dominator.

Missing support for characters beyond U+FFFF is the main problem caused by surrogates (their existence, even if indirect)—it normally comes of some kind of UCS-2/UTF-16 confusion. It’s not fair to disqualify them. The only (class of) case that I’m aware of for a long time where it’s not linked to that is with MySQL’s idiotic utf8 → utf8mb3 type.

You may not have encountered such bugs, but I’m very familiar with surrogate-related bugs, because I use a Compose key extensively. I haven’t been using Windows for the last year, but from time to time I would definitely encounter bugs that are certainly due to surrogates. On the web, I found bugs a few times, all but once in Rust WebAssembly things, such as https://github.com/Pauan/rust-dominator/issues/10. And even now I’m back on Linux, I know of one almost certainly surrogate-related bug: I can’t type astral plane characters in Zoom at all; pretty sure I had this problem back on Windows, too. Copy and paste, sure, but type, no, they become REPLACEMENT CHARACTER.

The history is unfortunate but I strongly refute that they had not much choice. UCS-2 should have been abandoned as a failed experiment. Certainly there had been significant investment into it in the last few years, but with the benefit of hindsight, switching to UTF-8 (which was invented before they decided on surrogates) would have made everyone’s life much easier, especially given its ASCII-compatibility.

Ah, BOM characters. Haven’t seen one in years. Good riddance.

I really don't understand why everyone jumps to Yew when it comes to front-end development. Dominator is a far cleaner and more Rust-orientated approach to building front-end apps. I have worked with both and I feel that Yew adds a lot complexity/forces a lot of design philosophies but gives very little back in terms of advantages.

Hi, I've just released a major new version of Silkenweb. It's a signals based web framework like Dominator or Sycamore, but with the emphasis on plain rust syntax rather than a macro DSL.

Check out the alternatives without vdom, especially Dominator https://github.com/Pauan/rust-dominator. It’s faster than nearly all JS frameworks. The underlying rust-signals it’s based on is a fantastic crate. Unfortunately it’s not very well documented (check the prs for some wip docs). I got a frontend up and going with reactivity and nice styles using trunk and tailwindcss with daisyUI very quickly.

- https://github.com/Pauan/rust-dominator

How does this compare to dominator?