Oberon
Avalonia
Oberon | Avalonia | |
---|---|---|
76 | 254 | |
426 | 23,749 | |
- | 1.3% | |
7.4 | 9.9 | |
about 2 months ago | 6 days ago | |
C++ | C# | |
GNU General Public License v3.0 only | MIT License |
Stars - the number of stars that a project has on GitHub. Growth - month over month growth in stars.
Activity is a relative number indicating how actively a project is being developed. Recent commits have higher weight than older ones.
For example, an activity of 9.0 indicates that a project is amongst the top 10% of the most actively developed projects that we are tracking.
Oberon
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Boehm Garbage Collector
> Sure there's a small overhead to smart pointers
Not so small, and it has the potential to significantly speed down an application when not used wisely. Here are e.g. some measurements where the programmer used C++11 and did everything with smart pointers: https://github.com/smarr/are-we-fast-yet/issues/80#issuecomm.... There was a speed down between factor 2 and 10 compared with the C++98 implementation. Also remember that smart pointers create memory leaks when used with circular references, and there is an additional memory allocation involved with each smart pointer.
> Garbage collection has an overhead too of course
The Boehm GC is surprisingly efficient. See e.g. these measurements: https://github.com/rochus-keller/Oberon/blob/master/testcase.... The same benchmark suite as above is compared with different versions of Mono (using the generational GC) and the C code (using Boehm GC) generated with my Oberon compiler. The latter only is 20% slower than the native C++98 version, and still twice as fast as Mono 5.
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Niklaus Wirth, or the Importance of Being Simple
Great, thanks!
There are books online for free, e.g.
https://people.inf.ethz.ch/wirth/ProgInOberonWR.pdf
and https://ssw.jku.at/Research/Books/Oberon2.pdf
Oberon+ is a superset of Oberon 90 and Oberon-2. Here is more information: https://oberon-lang.github.io/, and here is the current language specification: https://github.com/oberon-lang/specification/blob/master/The.... I already had valuable feedback here on HN concerning the channel extensions. Further research brought me to the conclusion, that Oberon+ should support both, channels and also monitors, because even in Go, the sync package primitives are used twice as much as channels. Mutexes and condition variables can be emulated with channels (I tried my luck here: https://www.quora.com/How-can-we-emulate-mutexes-and-conditi...), but for efficiency reasons I think monitors should be directly supported in the language as well, even if it might collide with the goal of simplicity.
Feel free to comment here or e.g. in https://github.com/rochus-keller/Oberon/discussions/45.
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Tex-Oberon: Make Project Oberon Pretty Again
> Does anyone know why Wirth never modernized his style?
Readability. It's easier to read the source code with uppercase keywords. (I think Wirth once said that code is written once but read many times). See this source code - https://raw.githubusercontent.com/rochus-keller/OberonSystem... - to get an idea of this (the uppercase keywords allow you to easily scan the blocks of code). Ofcourse, one can claim that the same can be achieved better today with colour-coded keywords.
If I remember right, the Oberon+ IDE - https://github.com/rochus-keller/Oberon - gives you an option to disable this and use lowercase keywords.
- FreeOberon cross-platform Oberon language IDD
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Project Oberon (New Edition 2013)
> gain a deep understanding of it .. generate smaller subsets of the system
You can use the OberonViewer for this purpose with the original source code, or the Oberon IDE with a version of the Project Oberon System which runs with SDL on all platforms, see https://github.com/rochus-keller/oberon/#binary-versions and https://github.com/rochus-keller/OberonSystem/tree/FFI
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KolibriOS on Single Floppy Disk
> Regardless, which one is more likely to be ported to a different architecture in the future?
Not sure I understand the question. I'm talking about CPU architectures. The current implementation is in x86 assembler. So if you want to run it on AMD64 or ARM, then you have to replace all assembler files, in the present case probable the full source code.
> what are the comparative performance benchmarks of the low-level language versus the high-level language?
I don't have any measurements. But consider that many operating systems are implemented in C (e.g. Linux) with only isolated parts in assembler, so it is easier to port to other architectures. Linux apparently is fast enough and available for nearly every CPU. Oberon in contrast to C is garbage collected, which also affects performance. I have measurements comparing the same benchmark suite implemented in C++ and in Oberon, where the former is about 22% faster (see https://github.com/rochus-keller/Oberon/blob/master/testcase...).
- Why Use Pascal?
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C or LLVM for a fast backend?
I actually had a similar problem some years ago and finally moved away from LLVM because of complexity, continuous research effort and performance. My current Oberon+ implementation works like this: the CIL code generator together with Mono is used during development, integrated with the IDE, using the debugging features integrated in Mono; to deploy the application and to gain another factor 2 of performance C99 instead of CIL can be generated and compiled with any compatible toolchain. Here are some performance measurements: https://github.com/rochus-keller/Oberon/blob/master/testcases/Are-we-fast-yet/Are-we-fast-yet_results_linux.pdf. Compiling to CIL is very fast and the time Mono needs to compile and run is barely noticable.
- Do transpilers just use a lot of string manipulation and concatenation to output the target language?
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Native AOT Overview
> annoying aspects was requiring the .NET runtime ... OpenJDK is a blessed implementation in a way that Mono never was
Which is unjustified, because Mono CLR is just a single executable less than 5 MB which you can download and run without a complicated installation process (see e.g. https://github.com/rochus-keller/Oberon/#binary-versions ). AOT compilation on the other hand is a huge and complex installation depending on a lot of stuff including LLVM, and the resulting executables are not really smaller than the CLR + mscorlib + app.
Avalonia
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Industrial Controller? Windows or Linux?
You might also want to look at AvaloniaUI[0] for a cross platform .NET GUI library. It is similar to WPF but much nicer to work with.
[0] https://github.com/AvaloniaUI/Avalonia
- Avalonia – Farewell to the .NET Foundation
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AvaloniaUI: Create Multi-Platform Apps with .NET
Production user here. There's no money gotchas. They're above reproach. In fact, I've received considerable free support from their devs on GitHub Issues [1].
The Avalonia business model is based on selling XPF, which runs WPF (Windows-only) apps on other platforms. That's very interesting to big corps with existing codebases.
See my comment [2]
[1] https://github.com/AvaloniaUI/Avalonia/issues
[2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39246988#39249128
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.NET on Linux: What a Contrast
Yes, but the portable GUI frameworks by Microsoft themselves are generally not very good, and they tend to be abandoned after a couple of years.
Avalonia is developed outside of the Microsoft corporate madness and seems to be slowly becoming the defacto cross-platform framework because it is expected to last a bit longer than a manager's attention span: https://avaloniaui.net/
- Too many Mac apps are being built with Electron
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Ask HN: Do you have a problem you'd pay to have taken away?
Not my comment, but relevant here "The problem with compiling Skia to WASM is you'll lose any benefits of hardware graphics acceleration on the device."
(From https://github.com/AvaloniaUI/Avalonia/discussions/6831#disc... )
- Dezvoltare aplicatie desktop
- Ask HN: How to create web, mobile, and desktop apps from a single code base?
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.NET 8 – .NET Blog
It's a bit of a hit and miss as of today. CLI, back-end and natively compiled libraries (think dll/so/dylib or even .lib/.a - you can statically link NAOT binaries into other "unmanaged" code) work best, GUI - requires more work.
Avalonia[0] and MAUI[1] have known working templates with it, but YMMV.
[0] https://github.com/lixinyang123/AvaloniaAOT / https://github.com/AvaloniaUI/Avalonia/ / honorable mention https://github.com/VincentH-Net/CSharpForMarkup
[1] https://github.com/dotnet/maui (try out with just true in csproj - it is known to work e.g. on iOS)
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One Game, by One Man, on Six Platforms: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly
For desktop, Avalonia, hands down.
https://avaloniaui.net/
Open source, powered by Skia, backed by JetBrains, and quite battle-tested at this point for small to medium-sized apps. In theory perfectly capable for enterprise as well, since it's basically a spiritual successor to WPF, which has been an industry standard for about 15 years.
They're diving into mobile and WASM well, but that's more of a recent effort and I haven't tested that yet.
What are some alternatives?
oberon-riscv - Oberon RISC-V port, based on Samuel Falvo's RISC-V compiler and Peter de Wachter's Project Norebo. Part of an academic project to evaluate Project Oberon on RISC-V.
Uno Platform - Build Mobile, Desktop and WebAssembly apps with C# and XAML. Today. Open source and professionally supported.
MoarVM - A VM with adaptive optimization and JIT compilation, built for Rakudo
Introducing .NET Multi-platform App UI (MAUI) - .NET MAUI is the .NET Multi-platform App UI, a framework for building native device applications spanning mobile, tablet, and desktop.
Smalltalk - Parser, code model, interpreter and navigable browser for the original Xerox Smalltalk-80 v2 sources and virtual image file
WPF - WPF is a .NET Core UI framework for building Windows desktop applications.
tectonic - A modernized, complete, self-contained TeX/LaTeX engine, powered by XeTeX and TeXLive.
Eto.Forms - Cross platform GUI framework for desktop and mobile applications in .NET
aws-lambda-rust-runtime - A Rust runtime for AWS Lambda
MahApps.Metro - A framework that allows developers to cobble together a better UI for their own WPF applications with minimal effort.
atldotnet - Fully managed, portable and easy-to-use C# library to read and edit audio data and metadata (tags) from various audio formats, playlists and CUE sheets
Gtk# - Gtk# is a Mono/.NET binding to the cross platform Gtk+ GUI toolkit and the foundation of most GUI apps built with Mono