Enzyme.jl VS Nim

It's possible but at this time it's not recommended or documented as right now it requires writing some LLVM-level stuff and a better system is coming soon (see https://github.com/EnzymeAD/Enzyme.jl/pull/177)

Can you point to a concrete example of one that someone would run into when using the differential equation solvers with the default and recommended Enzyme AD for vector-Jacobian products? I'd be happy to look into it, but there do not currently seem to be any correctness issues in the Enzyme issue tracker that are current (3 issues are open but they all seem to be fixed, other than https://github.com/EnzymeAD/Enzyme.jl/issues/278 which is actually an activity analysis bug in LLVM). So please be more specific. The issue with Enzyme right now seems to moreso be about finding functional forms that compile, and it throws compile-time errors in the event that it cannot fully analyze the program and if it has too much dynamic behavior (example: https://github.com/EnzymeAD/Enzyme.jl/issues/368).

Additional note, we recently did a overhaul of SciMLSensitivity (https://sensitivity.sciml.ai/dev/) and setup a system which amounts to 15 hours of direct unit tests doing a combinatoric check of arguments with 4 hours of downstream testing (https://github.com/SciML/SciMLSensitivity.jl/actions/runs/25...). What that identified is that any remaining issues that can arise are due to the implicit parameters mechanism in Zygote (Zygote.params). To counteract this upstream issue, we (a) try to default to never default to Zygote VJPs whenever we can avoid it (hence defaulting to Enzyme and ReverseDiff first as previously mentioned), and (b) put in a mechanism for early error throwing if Zygote hits any not implemented derivative case with an explicit error message (https://github.com/SciML/SciMLSensitivity.jl/blob/v7.0.1/src...). We have alerted the devs of the machine learning libraries, and from this there has been a lot of movement. In particular, a globals-free machine learning library, Lux.jl, was created with fully explicit parameters https://lux.csail.mit.edu/dev/, and thus by design it cannot have this issue. In addition, the Flux.jl library itself is looking to do a redesign that eliminates implicit parameters (https://github.com/FluxML/Flux.jl/issues/1986). Which design will be the one in the end, that's uncertain right now, but it's clear that no matter what the future designs of the deep learning libraries will fully cut out that part of Zygote.jl. And additionally, the other AD libraries (Enzyme and Diffractor for example) do not have this "feature", so it's an issue that can only arise from a specific (not recommended) way of using Zygote (which now throws explicit error messages early and often if used anywhere near SciML because I don't tolerate it).

So from this, SciML should be rather safe and if not, please share some details and I'd be happy to dig in.

Lots of things are being rewritten. Remember we just released a new neural network library the other day, SimpleChains.jl, and showed that it gave about a 10x speed improvement on modern CPUs with multithreading enabled vs Jax Equinox (and 22x when AVX-512 is enabled) for smaller neural network and matrix-vector types of cases (https://julialang.org/blog/2022/04/simple-chains/). Then there's Lux.jl fixing some major issues of Flux.jl (https://github.com/avik-pal/Lux.jl). Pretty much everything is switching to Enzyme which improves performance quite a bit over Zygote and allows for full mutation support (https://github.com/EnzymeAD/Enzyme.jl). So an entire machine learning stack is already seeing parts release.

Right now we're in a bit of an uncomfortable spot where we have to use Zygote for a few things and then Enzyme for everything else, but the custom rules system is rather close and that's the piece that's needed to make the full transition.

enzyme.jl is probably the quickest way to play with enzyme: https://github.com/wsmoses/Enzyme.jl

"Maybe they let you declare some subgraph as 'dynamic' to avoid static optimizations?" What you just described is Tensorflow Eager and why it has some performance issues. XLA makes some pretty strong assumptions and I don't that should change. Tensorflow's ability to automatically generate good parallelized production code stems from the restrictions it has imposed. So I wouldn't even try for a "one true AD to rule them all" since making things more flexible will reduce the amount of compiler optimizations that can be automatically performed.

To get the more flexible form, you really would want to do it in a way that uses a full programming language's IR as its target. I think trying to use a fully dynamic programming language IR directly (Python, R, etc.) directly would be pretty insane because it would be hard to enforce rules and get performance. So some language that has a front end over an optimizing compiler (LLVM) would probably make the most sense. Zygote and Diffractor uses Julia's IR, but there are other ways to do this as well. Enzyme (https://github.com/wsmoses/Enzyme.jl) uses the LLVM IR directly for doing source-to-source translations. Using some dialect of LLVM (provided by MLIR) might be an interesting place to write a more ML-focused flexible AD system. Swift for Tensorflow used the Swift IR. This mindset starts to show why those tools were chosen.

Have you explored the SciML landscape at all (?):

https://sciml.ai/

There are a number of components here which enable (what I would call) the expression of more advanced models using Julia's nice compositional properties.

Flux.jl is of course what most people would think of here (one of Julia's deep learning frameworks). But the reality behind Flux.jl is that it is just Julia code -- nothing too fancy.

There's ongoing work for AD in several directions -- including a Julia interface to Enzyme: https://github.com/wsmoses/Enzyme.jl

Also, a new AD system which Keno (who you'll see comment below or above) has been working on -- see Diffractor.jl on the JuliaCon schedule (for example).

Long story short -- there's quite a lot of work going on.

It may not seem like there is a "unified" package -- but that's because packages compose so well together in Julia, there's really no need for that.

The name of the LLVM AD tool is actually Enzyme [http://enzyme.mit.edu/] (Zygote is a Julia tool)

Also see the Julia package that makes it acessible with a high level interface and probably one of the easier ways to play with it: https://github.com/wsmoses/Enzyme.jl.

22. Nim - $80,000

I think the right answer to your question would be NimLang[0]. In reality, if you're seeking to use this in any enterprise context, you'd most likely want to select the subset of C++ that makes sense for you or just use C#.

[0]https://nim-lang.org/

I don't think it's a rust-inspired language, but since it has strong typing and compiles to javascript, did you give a look at nim [0] ?

For what it takes, I find the language very expressive without the verbosity in rust that reminds me java. And it is also very flexible.

[0] : https://nim-lang.org/

I see a valid cert for https://nim-lang.org/

FYI, on the front page, https://nim-lang.org, in large type you have this:

> Nim is a statically typed compiled systems programming language. It combines successful concepts from mature languages like Python, Ada and Modula.

You better off with using a compiled language.

If you interested in a language that's compiled, fast, but as easy and pleasant as Python - I'd recommend you take a look at [Nim](https://nim-lang.org).

And to prove what Nim's capable of - here's a cool repo with 100+ cli apps someone wrote in Nim: [c-blake/bu](https://github.com/c-blake/bu)

Chapel has at least several full-time developers at Cray/HPE and (I think) the US national labs, and has had some for almost two decades. That's much more than $100k.

Chapel is also just one of many other projects broadly interested in developing new programming languages for "high performance" programming. Out of that large field, Chapel is not especially related to the specific ideas or design goals of Mojo. Much more related are things like Codon (https://exaloop.io), and the metaprogramming models in Terra (https://terralang.org), Nim (https://nim-lang.org), and Zig (https://ziglang.org).

But Chapel is great! It has a lot of good ideas, especially for distributed-memory programming, which is its historical focus. It is more related to Legion (https://legion.stanford.edu, https://regent-lang.org), parallel & distributed Fortran, ZPL, etc.