swapforth
jonesforth
swapforth | jonesforth | |
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5 | 41 | |
274 | 968 | |
- | - | |
4.6 | 0.0 | |
5 months ago | about 1 year ago | |
Forth | Assembly | |
BSD 3-clause "New" or "Revised" License | - |
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swapforth
- Making my own forth implementation
- FPGAs for interpreted programming languages?
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How many LUT for an 8 bit CPU?
Thanks! Found the port of this to the board I want :) https://github.com/jamesbowman/swapforth/tree/master/j1a
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The RISC Deprogrammer
It's a standard thing to do in EE curricula; you normally do it in a one-semester class, and there are literally thousands of open-source synthesizable CPU cores on GitHub now.
To take two examples to show that designing a CPU is less work than writing a novel:
- Chuck Thacker's "A Tiny Computer", fairly similar to the Nova, is a page and a half of synthesizable Verilog; it runs at 66 MHz in 200 LUTs of a Virtex-5: https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~swm11/examples/bluespec/Tiny3/Thac...
- James Bowman's J1A is more like Chuck Moore's MuP21 and is about three pages of synthesizable Verilog: https://github.com/jamesbowman/swapforth/blob/master/j1a/ver... and https://github.com/jamesbowman/swapforth/blob/master/j1a/ver.... You can build it with Claire Wolf's iCEStorm (yosys, etc.) and run it on any but Lattice's tiniest FPGAs; it takes up 1162 4-input LUTs.
I haven't quite done it myself. Last time I played https://nandgame.com/ it took me a couple of hours to play through the hardware design levels. But that's not really "design" in the sense of defining the instruction set (which is also kind of Nova-like), thinking through state machine design, and trying different pipeline depths; you're mostly just doing the kind of logic minimization exercises you'd normally delegate to yosys.
In https://github.com/kragen/calculusvaporis I designed a CPU instruction set, wrote a simulator for it, wrote and tested some simple programs, designed a CPU at the RTL level, and sketched out gate-level logic designs to get an estimate of how big it would be. But I haven't simulated the RTL to verify it, written it down in an HDL, or breadboarded the circuit, so I'm reluctant to say that this qualifies as "designing a single CPU" either.
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The J1 Forth CPU
Also worth checking is the Swapforth Github repository.
jonesforth
- Konilo: A personal computing system in Forth
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Thinking Forth: A Language and Philosophy for Solving Problems [pdf]
Cool. Here are some other resources that I've encountered along the way of learning Forth:
- JonesForth: https://github.com/nornagon/jonesforth/blob/master/jonesfort...
This is legit a text that goes the an x86 Forth implementation. Actually, it's just an implementation with really extensive comments. That said, including whitespace and comments, it's just 2000 lines and the pedagogy is excellent. Highly recommended for anyone who would rather see behind the curtain before picking up a larger text.
- SmithForth: https://dacvs.neocities.org/SF/
So, Smith decided to hand-write a Forth directly in x86-64 opcodes (well, the corresponding ascii hex bytes). It's incredibly slim and enlightening how you can bootstrap a language in just a couple hundred bytes or so.
This project actually inspired me to really learn the x86-64 architecture, so I ended up hand-decompiling the SmithForth binary instead of going through his commented implementation. Hand-decompilation is an absolutely fascinating exercise. You learn all about ELF structure, opcode encodings, and actually start to see the gaps where microarchitectural details shine through. Highly recommended for any hacker that really wants to grok low level details.
- Mecrisp: https://mecrisp.sourceforge.net/
An amazingly fast Forth implementation for MSP430, ARM, RISC-V, MIPS, and some FPGAs. This gave me one really nice understanding of Forth as
A REPL into your hardware!
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Problem Running JonesFORTH
I've git-cloned JonesFORTH (https://github.com/nornagon/jonesforth/blob/master/jonesforth.S) and achieved to compile it (i.e. run make w/o an error. When I start the executable, it presents me with an empty line, and when I say BYE, it says PARSE ERROR: bye.
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Ask HN: Where do I find good code to read?
Is there any particular language you're looking for? I've found some languages hideous until I understood them and could appreciate their respective graces. Off the top of my head the I can think of a couple.
The first is Jones Forth (https://github.com/nornagon/jonesforth), start with jonesforth.S and move into jonesforth.f. I really enjoyed following along with it and trying my hand at making my own stack based language.
The other is Xv6, a teaching operating system from MIT (https://pdos.csail.mit.edu/6.828/2021/xv6.html), not all the code or implementations are top notch but it shows you non-optimized versions (just because they're simple and more readable) of different concepts used in OS design.
If you're interested in the embedded world, there is a really neat project I've been following that feels a more structured and safe (as in fault-tolerant) while still staying pretty simple (both conceptually and in the code itself): Hubris and Humility (https://hubris.oxide.computer/).
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Dusk OS: 32-bit Forth OS. Useful during first stage of civilizational collapse
Very low hardware requirements, so basic industrial control at the level where you'd otherwise use an Arduino or so but on scavenged hardware. Forth is ridiculously simple to get an implementation running.
https://github.com/nornagon/jonesforth/blob/master/jonesfort...
Is a nice starting point. It's obviously not as compact as say 'Brainfuck' but it is far more versatile.
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Making my own forth implementation
OP mentioned jonesforth, but linked to a nasm port of it. Which is probably good it’s just that the documentation in the comments with ascii art doesn’t look right on my screen. So here’s a more common repo: https://github.com/nornagon/jonesforth
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Struggling with looping constructs, BEGIN WHILE REPEAT
Rip the asm macros for the basic FORTH words out of this and then embed them in a C binary, statically linked with your favourite libs for whatever task. Although I haven't tried this yet, I'm planning on doing it with ncurses for my own Roguelike. From there, if you can convert the function calls and your parameters down to raw numbers, you can send instructions to ncurses or whatever other API you like, directly from a FORTH stack.
- I'm wondering why so few forth microcontoller tutorials are out there?
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replace jonesforth links to the left by proper link
or the mirror of this site in github: https://github.com/nornagon/jonesforth
- Languages to implement in space-constrained environments
What are some alternatives?
arkam - A Simple Stack VM and Forth
stoneknifeforth - a tiny self-hosted Forth implementation
lbForth - Self-hosting metacompiled Forth, bootstrapping from a few lines of C; targets Linux, Windows, ARM, RISC-V, 68000, PDP-11, asm.js.
factor - Factor programming language
subleq - 16-bit SUBLEQ CPU running eForth - just for fun
durexforth - Modern C64 Forth
gforth - Gforth mirror on GitHub (original is on Savannah)
tinyrenderer - A brief computer graphics / rendering course
sectorforth - sectorforth is a 16-bit x86 Forth that fits in a 512-byte boot sector.
gforth-raylib - Raylib 3.5 bindings for Gforth. The name is backwards for obvious reasons.
SavjeeCoin - A simple blockchain in Javascript. For educational purposes only.