rum VS re-frame

(Note that Rum is also a React wrapper, but you don't have to use that part of it; you can simply use it for static rendering of HTML.)

https://github.com/tonsky/rum

I love React as long as it has a thin skim of clojurescript over top. Rum is the underdog compared to reagent but is still my weapon of choice - https://github.com/tonsky/rum

Was disillusioned when I had to dive into a pure js project using it.

The real benefit, I think, is that you get the well established Clojure idioms around isolating and managing mutable state.

State is stored in a Atom, which is atomically mutated, and reactive components essentially 'subscribe' to updates upon that atom to re render.

The mutations can be handled centrally by a message queue, but really, event sourcing like that is not always needed.

We've been using re-om during the last 6 months and it has really made our lives much easier. Before open-sourcing it, we decided to extract from re-om the code that was independent of any view technology. This code is now part of reffectory and it might be used as the base for creating frameworks similar to re-om for other view technologies, like for example rum, or even for pure Clojure projects.

I've had an in-browser animated meme editor in the freezer for a few years now:

https://www.ultime.me/

The idea came when I wanted to make a simple animated meme, but found it exceedingly frustrating to caption a simple animated gif with nice text options (like outlines). Over time, it's grown to have full keyframe animation for all text and image/video clip attributes, so it is actually pretty capable short of using a desktop video editing/fx package.

That said, the UX is bad and I should feel bad :) . I made the deliberate choice up front to focus on the underlying data model and internal APIs rather than polishing the UI - as such, it is very much an engineer interface. It would be more usable with some demo videos or call-to-action helpers for new users, but really the UX just needs reworked. Especially around animation/keyframing.

On the bright side, the clean data model and content addressable assets leave the path clear to add things like collaborative multi-user meme editing, git like meme-forking(and diffing?), and so forth.

Started it about 3 years ago when I had a period of mostly free time to play. It's been idle for a long time due to starting a family and getting consulting momentum, but I'm intending to make the time this year to polish the UX to the point of general usability and experiment with promotion/monetization. Failing that, I'll probably just open source it and write a couple of blog posts about the internals.

It is more or less a static web app, with no server side function short of some optional stats collection. It's written in Clojurescript/Clojure and uses https://github.com/tonsky/rum as a React wrapper and

This article always reminds me of this excerpt from re-frame’s docs [0]:

> Now, you think and design abstractly for a living, and that repetition will feel uncomfortable. It will call to you like a Siren: "refaaaaactoooor meeeee". "Maaaake it DRYYYY". So here's my tip: tie yourself to the mast and sail on. That repetition is good. It is serving a purpose. Just sail on.

[0]: https://github.com/day8/re-frame/blob/master/docs/correcting...

* Single-Page App: shadow-cljs for the build concerns (https://github.com/thheller/shadow-cljs), Reagent with Re-frame for complex/large app (https://reagent-project.github.io and https://github.com/day8/re-frame). Even if we now prefer using HTMX (https://htmx.org) and server-side rendering (Hiccup way of manipulating HTML is just amazing, https://github.com/weavejester/hiccup).

Big and/or complete projects that use re-frame The main list: https://github.com/day8/re-frame/blob/master/docs/External-Resources.md

Reflet is a set of tools for building Re-frame + React based web apps with graph and non-graph data models. This includes:

https://github.com/day8/re-frame

Notably the author of re-frame has been weary of hooks.

I think that’s for a good reason. The approach in re frame feels like the best way to manage state so far for a react based app. Everything that changes state flows through an event. State can only be observed through subscriptions. Side effects are isolated to their own type of event. Debugging and testing are so straight forward with these concepts.

Redux got close but it has two problems in my mind. Like hooks, it encapsulates for no good reason. Put the state in one thing that you can observe holistically before and after pure events. It also has too much boiler plate.

The cljs stack I hear about a lot (and use) is ShadowCLJS with reagent (https://reagent-project.github.io/) and re-frame (https://day8.github.io/re-frame/). ShadowCLJS is more of a build tool, but is really well documented and easy to use. Reagent is basically react but a simpler API, and re-frame is a layer on top of that provides data subscriptions and event-handlers to manage app state. It's overkill for some apps but I find it's actually super easy to work with and not as much complexity as I thought.

For backend there is luminus (https://luminusweb.com/) or Kit (https://kit-clj.github.io/). They are basically project templates that wire together a ton of popular solutions for various things - database access, migrations, security, html templating, etc. Also includes frontend frameworks like re-frame if you want.

Reflet aims to be a natural progression on top of Re-frame to support complex, data driven requirements. In that sense, it is both easy to learn, but powerful. You could say it's sort of like Re-frame++ (or Fulcro for Re-frame). Its main design goals are:

At my current client we're working on having a frontend architecture for writing SPAs in JavaScript similar to re-frame's one: an event-driven bus with effects and coeffects for state management[1] (commands) and subscriptions using reselect's selectors (queries).

Some of us had worked with effects and coeffects before while developing SPAs with re-frame and had experienced how good it is. After working with re-frame, when you come to horizon, you realize how a good architecture can make a dramatic difference in clarity, testability, understandability and easiness of change.

https://youtu.be/geeK1-jjlhY (talk about an initial prototype with re-frame and the decision to do a rewrite in Clojure)