holochain VS automerge-rs

It’s been in the works for a few years, and recently reached its beta-rc stage. There’s a quick scaffolding tool, a Typescript client, Rust client (being updated), integration with Nix, Rust and Typescript testing suites, a Tauri-based launcher, an Electron template, etc. It can even be deployed in a cloud instance if you wish. There’s a pretty passionate community on Discord. The Open Source Initiative even approved the Cryptographic Autonomy License specifically for Holochain apps.

Holochain is a framework for building Peer-to-Peer apps. Everyone can make their own app which utilizes Holochain. Holochain is build by the Holochain Foundation as an Open Source project, i.e. the source code is openly available on Github and you can use and modify it as you wish. Other than providing and developing the framework, the Holochain Foundation will have no control over any part of the app you build. The Foundation also cannot control which apps are built using Holochain. It does not have any governance power in this regard.

I have been thinking about architectural models for making our application distributed, such as Holochain and Gun.eco.

I'm curious about future potential synergies between Holochain ( https://github.com/holochain/holochain ) and the Cosmos ecosystem, considering the consensus engine (under development : https://github.com/cosmos/cosmos-rust/tree/main/cosmrs ), the Interchain Blockchain Protocol ( https://github.com/informalsystems/ibc-rs ) and the smart contacts module (https://github.com/CosmWasm/cosmwasm ) exist in Rust.

are running encrypted app code for them so that they can take part in the app/network, without having the required technical chops (the holofuel currency measures processing power). the FAQ does a good job of explaining it a bit more: https://holo.host/faq/

i'm not super interested in the whole holo thing (they sold holofuel hosting credits). i am glad they did it because it meant the team could ramp up development.

about the marx and engels thing. i am most excited about the potential for http://valueflo.ws on top of holochain [3], because it will allow us to move away from today's Enterprise Resource Planning (ERP) software, into a new paradigm of Network Resource Planning (ERP) software, that i hope will have a big impact on supply chains of the next economy (socialist).

[1] https://github.com/holochain/holochain

[2] https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/holo-take-back-the-intern...

[3] https://github.com/holo-rea/holo-rea

Harmony One & Holochain

Hey y'all. I've been bouncing ideas around in my skull for how to implement a peer-to-peer / distributed / decentralized / serverless game backend, mostly for the lulz, the what-if's, and the is-it-even-possible's. It would run over a p2p distributed database, peer validation, encryption/signing, based on Holochain, and would include a form of distributed ECS for managing "server" logic.

> It would force the global north to actually build what it's consuming instead of extracting rents from intellectual property. That won't happen.

Oh fuck yes it will happen! Come join us at:

https://futureeconomiesreadinggroup.github.io

http://valueflo.ws

http://holochain.org

...and a bunch of other DWeb projects (many are listed/named in my comment history).

See also, Autosurgeon (with a 0.3.0 release today), which is a higher level API on top of Automerge for Rust:

I'm building a mobile app with a server backend, and I was looking for resources to build them in an offline-first way (since unlike on the browser, people expect to use apps offline, if they can, such as fitness or habit trackers).

I found the concept of conflict-free relational data types (CRDTS) interesting as it allows you to have fully offline experiences while also having a conflict-free syncing experience. I was looking for some good libraries and came across automerge [0] and yrs [1], but both had some rough APIs as they're primarily low-level Rust libraries that are wrapped by higher-level TypeScript APIs.

Autosurgeon wraps the low-level API of automerge to make it much more ergonomic, closer to the TypeScript experience, but in Rust of course. You can for example use `struct`s which autosurgeon will serialize and deserialize automatically, which is not present in base automerge, which focuses more on string keys and arbitrary values.

I am planning on using this together with Flutter and flutter_rust_bridge [2] in order to use this same Rust library everywhere. In this case, the server just becomes another (albeit more privileged) client.

[0] https://github.com/automerge/automerge-rs

[1] https://github.com/y-crdt/y-crdt

[2] https://github.com/fzyzcjy/flutter_rust_bridge

I found the concept of conflict-free relational data types (CRDTS) interesting as it allows you to have fully offline experiences while also having a conflict-free syncing experience. I was looking for some good libraries and came across automerge and yrs, but both had some rough APIs as they're primarily low-level libraries that are wrapped by TypeScript APIs.

Yes, the plan is to use PostgreSQL. I had a discussion with one of the devs in this ticket about the strategy for this.

In any case, my current plan is to use Automerge for the data handling itself (so I can easily do collaboration), but that crate doesn't handle on-disk storage. For this I need another solution, and a K/V store is well suited for this task.

15 years working in software, Rust has been my favourite language for the last 2. Recently completed a contract to prototype a distributed Tailscale-inspired VPN built on Ink and Switch's CRDT project automerge-rs.

Complex topic. There's a very easy-to-use CRDT library for Rust (automerge), while there isn't much support for operational transforms (although Aper is new to me, I have to check it out).

I've been watching automerge-rs like a hawk, because they seem to be the only CRDT implementation where you don't need a Mathematics master to understand how to use it. They've been working on a rewrite for the last two years, hopefully they'll do a new release soon.

https://github.com/automerge/automerge-rs

By the way despite that particular repo (@localfirst/state) last being touched 6 months ago, Herb Caudill definitely seems still active in this space (I believe he's been working on other parts of this more recently -- e.g. ideas about authentication), and I think automerge development itself is quite active right now leading up to a 1.0 release which seems fairly imminent, for which a lot of fundamental work has been done, also coordinating with automerge-rs.