clasp
SICL
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clasp | SICL | |
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47 | 26 | |
2,508 | 1,051 | |
1.4% | - | |
9.7 | 9.9 | |
1 day ago | 4 days ago | |
Common Lisp | TeX | |
- | GNU General Public License v3.0 or later |
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clasp
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I Accidentally a Scheme
I accidentally a Common Lisp that interoperates with C++ (https://github.com/clasp-developers/clasp.git). We would also like to move beyond BDWGC and Whiffle looks interesting. I will reach out to you and maybe we can chat about it.
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Val, a high-level systems programming language
Clasp might be such a language, it seems.
https://github.com/clasp-developers/clasp
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The jank programming language (by Jeaye Wilkerson)
/u/jeaye are you aware of CLASP? https://github.com/clasp-developers/clasp https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbdXeRBbgDM
- Clasp v2.3.0 · Bytecode compiled images, preliminary Apple Silicon support, LLVM16.
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Proof of Concept clang plugin that automatically binds C/C++ -> Lua
Sounds to me like CLASP; it automatically exports C++ objects to be used from Common Lisp also via llvm.
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Running Lisp in production @ grammarly
Now, the difference of compiling speed of SBCL and CCL is not so big. Look at cl-benchmark, LispWorks is really fast, CCL is on par with Allegro, SBCL is close to CCL. Or https://github.com/clasp-developers/clasp/wiki/Relative-Compile-Performance-of-clasp, it depends on specific project (SBCL sometimes faster, slower, alike), overall difference is not big.
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What help is needed for Lisp community in order to make Lisp more popular?
So..
"Why do you want to make Lisp more popular? If you were sucessful, what would be different in the world, and why is that desirable to you?"
Normally at this point I'd listen to the response, and ask more questions based on that. That would wind up with a very, very deep thread, so I'll break a cardinal rule and pre-guess at some answers.
This kind of question comes up pretty frequently. In many cases, I suspect the motivation behind the question is "Wow! Here's this cool tool I've discovered. I want to make something really useful with it. I want to do it as part of a community effort; share my excitement with others, share in their excitement, and know that what I'm making is useful because others find it desirable and are excited by it." The field could be cooking, sports, old machine tools, tiny homes, or demo scene. Its the fundemental driver for most content on HN, YouTube, Instructables, and such. It is a Good Thing.
If that is your motivator, then my suggestion is to find something that bugs you and fix it. You've already decided you're only interested in code, not other aspects. You said you preferred vim, but the emacs ecosystem has a very rich set of sharp edges that need filing off, and a rich set of tools with which to attack them.
One example: even after 50 years there's no open IDE which allows you to easily globally rename a Lisp identifier. I don't know about LispWorks or other proprietary environments, but you can't in emacs or vim do a right-click on "foo" in "(defun foo ()...)" and select a command which automatically renames it in all invocations. [Queue lots of "but you can..." replies here.] I don't think vim is up to the task of doing this internally. It would be possible in emacs; but would require a huge effort with lots of help from other people. If you emerged alive from that rabbit warren you'd join the company of Certified "How Hard Could it Be?" Mad Scientists such as Dr. "I just want to draw molecules" Meister [1] and "Wouldn't an OS in Lisp be Cool" Froggey [2].
[1] https://github.com/clasp-developers/clasp
[2] Mezzano https://github.com/froggey/Mezzano
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Linux Kernel 6.1 Released with Initial Rust Code
But also, there's a reason why most implementations readily make an effort to provide interoperability tools with a variety of runtimes. Clasp much like ABCL gives access to a whole library of other libraries trivially wrapped to interoperate with at little to no performance to cost (depending on how thin you make the wrappers, mainly).
- Common Lisp Clasp v2.0.0 released
SICL
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Ask HN: Guide for Implementing Common Lisp
This is a very approachable paper from 1990 on one way to do it with a C kernel bootstrapping to Common Lisp: https://www.softwarepreservation.org/projects/LISP/kcl/paper... Kyoto Common Lisp (KCL) is the ancestor of today's Embeddable Common Lisp (ECL).
SICL is probably the best modern version of CL written in CL from a design standpoint, even if it's not taking over SBCL's role anytime soon: https://github.com/robert-strandh/SICL It uses some fancy bootstrapping to have the whole language available early, e.g. their definition of class 'symbol is:
(defclass symbol (t)
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An implementation of Common Lisp targeting Lua
That's pretty much the objective of SICL, which is "intentionally divided into many implementation-independent modules that are written in a totally or near-totally portable way, so as to allow other implementations to incorporate these modules from SICL, rather than having to maintain their own, perhaps implementation-specific versions".
https://github.com/robert-strandh/SICL
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Strong typing, a hill I'm willing to die on
Gladly!
https://github.com/robert-strandh/SICL (which I wrote a decent chunk of the compiler backend of.)
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lisp-in-lisp: an experimental implementation of the lisp interpreter in itself
I applaud your curiosity and initiative to explore. Are you aware of https://github.com/robert-strandh/SICL?
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NSA urges orgs to use memory-safe programming languages
I mean this Klein and this SICL. Self and Common Lisp are memory-safe, though the implementations need capabilities to manipulate memory; SICL encapsulates them using first-class global environments.
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Re-targeting (Lisp) compilers
There is significant overlap with SICL and its associated pieces which supply many of the other parts needed to make a Common Lisp. Some of these are Cluster which provides a portable and extensible assembler, Eclector which supplies a portable and extensible reader, Concrete-Syntax-Tree that supports source code tracking during compilation, ctype that implements the Common Lisp type system, and Clostrum that provides first-class environments for e.g. run-time, evaluation, and compilation. The SICL project has as one of its goals the creation of portable infrastructure for implementing Common Lisp, and these pieces are novel building blocks that were created as part of the project.
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Question from a new Lisper
Not really; you can do it with primitive operations e.g. here is the list in the Cleavir compiler and a paper on "magic" in Jikes RVM. SBCL also has a "virtual op"/vop language for code generation, and vops are written to manipulate objects with assembly snippets.
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When a young programmer who has been using C for several years is convinced that C is the best possible programming language and that people who don't prefer it just haven't use it enough, what is the best argument for Lisp vs C, given that they're already convinced in favor of C?
Both work. I basically never have to touch C or even FFI (cl+ssl being the main use of FFI for me), unless I am poking at SBCL guts in my spare time, and that isn't necessary either. I am sure many Haskell hackers are happy with their IO monad too.
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Some questions from a new user.
It's used in operating systems, compilers and CLIs.
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Open source compilers that use three address code as IR?
The Cleavir Common Lisp compiler uses three-address instructions in a control-flow graph, though it is intended more for production use than educational use.
What are some alternatives?
Wren - The Wren Programming Language. Wren is a small, fast, class-based concurrent scripting language.
HVM - A massively parallel, optimal functional runtime in Rust
gdb-dashboard - Modular visual interface for GDB in Python
whirlisp - A whirlwind Lisp adventure
CL-CXX-JIT - Common Lisp and CXX interoperation with JIT
one-more-re-nightmare - A fast regular expression compiler in Common Lisp
graalvm-clojure - This project contains a set of "hello world" projects to verify which Clojure libraries do actually compile and produce native images under GraalVM.
gophernotes - The Go kernel for Jupyter notebooks and nteract.
maru - Maru - a tiny self-hosting lisp dialect
river-runner - Uses USGS/MERIT Basin data to visualize the path of a rain droplet to its endpoint.
immer - Postmodern immutable and persistent data structures for C++ — value semantics at scale
Cleavir - an implementation-independent framework for creating Common Lisp compilers