py4cl2 VS magicl

I... recently got that working: https://github.com/digikar99/py4cl2/tree/master/cffi - Yes, CFFI! Yes, passing CL array data by reference!

I ended up using a fair bit of matplotlib through college and with colleagues. I too don't want to use python, but I also don't like throwing away its libraries, and I'm too lazy to invest in other* plotting ecosystems. In effect, I use up using matplotlib through py4cl/2.

Note that it is not my aim to replace the python ecosystem; I think that is far too lofy a goal to be of any good. My original intention was to interoperate with python through py4cl/2 or the likes, but felt that one needs a Common Lisp library for "small" operations, while "large" operations can be offloaded to python libraries through py4cl/2.

Python: Blender and Panda3D (game engine used for Disney's Toontown way back when) are both scriptable with Python. I've been able to successfully call Panda from Py4CL2 (thanks digikar for the help with that), but I have not tried with Blender yet. I think it's doable.

While you are at it I may as well mention https://github.com/digikar99/py4cl2

If performance is absolutely not a concern, then third option is using python libraries through py4cl/2. To put it differently, if calling python from lisp is not the bottleneck, then this is a feasible option.

py4cl2 (not py4cl!) author here. From the v2.9.0 docs:

py4cl and py4cl2 represent a fairly pragmatic example of method 1, using an OS child process to communicate back and forth with your python code. Python is fairly popular and well-enabled with libraries, so you can delegate things to python that leverage those libraries.

If you can structure your code so that data de/serialization is not a bottleneck, then you could access the python libraries using py4cl/2.

(Link didn't work for me)

https://github.com/quil-lang/magicl/blob/master/src/high-lev...

use MAGICL. [1] It is optionally and transparently accelerated by BLAS/LAPACK.

[1] https://github.com/quil-lang/magicl/blob/master/doc/high-lev...

Maybe have a look at how magicl does this?

This is essentially the first option, which is already supported by MAGICL by loading MAGICL/EXT-LAPACK [1].

[1] https://github.com/quil-lang/magicl#extensions

I think what the magicl team has done is brilliant - allowing multiple implementations is awesome.

Second up is magicl, especially useful if performance is a concern. This might not be as extensive as numcl, but it's been battle tested in the industry over the last decade or so. Because this uses generic functions, so long as you are using not-very-small arrays, performance should not be a concern for you. And even if you are, you could write your own functions that use the low-level functions that magicl's backends define. Otherwise performance can be at par with numpy.

This Dev How-To describes (I hope in enough detail) how to add these specialized routines to MAGICL.

I agree... and I do don't want be the person who has not rallied. I just took a look at guicho's issue from 2019. And here, you yourself have admitted that the high level interface is less than ideal and needs more work. However, the very point that magicl is an industry standard could imply that potentially radical backward-incompatible changes can be hard. But, honestly, I want to discuss this, time permitting!

Common Lisp is a great language to build new tools for data science, but currently has pretty awful library support existing data science workflows. Common Lisp is sorely lacking in high-quality statistics, plotting, and sparse arrays. There’s been a long work-in-progress library to bring flexible and high-performance linear algebra to Lisp, but it needs more contributors.