eioio VS ionide-vscode-fsharp

the actual project (Readme has some code samples): https://github.com/ocaml-multicore/eio

For 5.0+ you might want to look at https://github.com/ocaml-multicore/eio for how effects can make async much more pleasant

Great post! I would love to see this extended to OCaml 5 (with eio) and Haskell

Second, effects enable a new style of concurrency libraries like eio that forgoes the need to wrap every asynchronous computation in a monad.

> This is realllly unidiomatic in real world Haskell.

Whether idiomatic or not does not matter. It proves my point:

IO won't save you, and even very mundane effects are not part of the game…

Idris is the "better Haskell" sure, but the effect tracking is still part of the uncanny valley (still IO monad based).

Koka is a toy, and Frank mostly "only a paper" (even there is some code out there).

The "Frank concept" is to some degree implemented in the Unison language, though:

https://www.unison-lang.org/learn/fundamentals/abilities/

Having a notion of co-effects (or however you please to call them) is imho actually much more important than talking about effects (as effects are in fact neither values nor types—something that all the IO kludges get wrong).

I think the first practicable approach in the mainstream about this topic will be what gets researched and developed for Scala. The main take away is that you need to look at things form the co-effects side first and foremost!

In case anybody is interested in what happens in Scala land in this regard:

https://www.slideshare.net/slideshow/embed_code/key/aLE9M37d...

https://docs.scala-lang.org/scala3/reference/experimental/cc...

But also the development in OCaml seems interesting:

https://github.com/ocaml-multicore/eio#design-note-capabilit...

Look mom, "effects", but without the monad headache!

To enable access to all these features, an exciting new library called Eio is being developed. It uses a new paradigm of direct-style concurrent I/O programming, without the need for monads or async/await, thus avoiding the function colour problem.

I'd love to see something similar to Microsoft's Ionide project or for JetBrains to invest in IDE support.

> Pretty good, https://ionide.io

It pains me to admit it because I really like F# but, with due respect to the developers, Ionide and its related projects are the most unstable toolchain I've ever used.

Spend half a day reloading the editor because the extension keeps hanging on non-trivial MSBuild only to discover that the formatter has truncated in half one of the files you worked on due to a soundness bug. (OCaml's editor support, in contrast, is quite stable.)

Rider is the best editing experience I've had with F#, by far.

I know it's a recurring topic but it's reaching a high level of pain *again* (see NET SDK 6.0.400 and 7.0.100 previews don't currently work with Ionide).

I don't disagree but it owes a lot of that to OCaml. That said, since we're talking about C#, F# and VS Code I'm gonna talk about a pet peeve I have. If you open a C# project in VS Code when the "Ionide" (basically the F# plugin for Code) is installed then Ionide thinks it's a F# project and will open some F# stuff after a few seconds (or prompt you to setup some F# stuff in its gitignore). The root cause has been identified (plugin activates when it sees a ".sln" file), a PR have been opened and rejected with no mention as to why (https://github.com/ionide/ionide-vscode-fsharp/pull/1401) and the developers behind it are frustratingly non-communicative about it, closing issues about it (https://github.com/ionide/ionide-vscode-fsharp/issues/1701). Usual rules about OSS maintainers apply, they don't technically owe us users anything ... but man it feels like we're being trolled by now :D

F# doesn't have a hard dependency on vscode. Resources from MS will obviously encourage using MS tooling, but ionide [1] is really good. The lsp+neovim workflow is not as good but getting better.

[1] https://ionide.io/

Important thread about this: https://github.com/ionide/ionide-vscode-fsharp/issues/1693

Perf Avore was developed on VSCode using the ionide plugin and dotnet cli.

I was on .Net 5 but same issue on 6. I tried the fix here- setting FSharp.dotnetRoot explicitly in settings.json and so far it seems better.

Make sure to keep an eye on this MR for that very capability :)