Concourse VS Wekan

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> Why bother, when Dagger caches everything automatically?

The fear with needing to run `npm ci` (or better, `pnpm install`) before running dagger is on the amount of time required to get this step to run. Sure, in the early days, trying out toy examples, when the only dependencies are from dagger upstream, very little time at all. But what happens when I start pulling more and more dependencies from the Node ecosystem to build the Dagger pipeline? Your documentation includes examples like pulling in `@google-cloud/run` as a dependency: https://docs.dagger.io/620941/github-google-cloud#step-3-cre... and similar for Azure: https://docs.dagger.io/620301/azure-pipelines-container-inst... . The more dependencies brought in - the longer `npm ci` is going to take on GitHub Actions. And it's pretty predictable that, in a complicated pipeline, the list of dependencies is going to get pretty big - at least a dependency per infrastructure provider we use, plus inevitably all the random Node dependencies that work their way into any Node project, like eslint, dotenv, prettier, testing dependencies... I think I have a reasonable fear that `npm ci` just for the Dagger pipeline will hit multiple minutes, and then developers who expect linting and similar short-run jobs to finish within 30 seconds are going to wonder why they're dealing with this overhead.

It's worth noting that one of Concourse's problems was, even with webhooks setup for GitHub to notify Concourse to begin a build, Concourse's design required it to dump the contents of the webhook and query the GitHub API for the same information (whether there were new commits) before starting a pipeline and cloning the repository (see: https://github.com/concourse/concourse/issues/2240 ). And that was for a CI/CD system where, for all YAML's faults, for sure one of its strengths is that it doesn't require running `npm ci`, with all its associated slowness. So please take it on faith that, if even a relatively small source of latency like that was felt in Concourse, for sure the latency from running `npm ci` will be felt, and Dagger's users (DevOps) will be put in an uncomfortable place where they need to defend the choice of Dagger from their users (developers) who go home and build a toy example on AlternateCI which runs what they need much faster.

> I will concede that Dagger’s clustering capabilities are not great yet

Herein my argument. It's not that I'm not convinced that building pipelines in a general-purpose programming language is a better approach compared to YAML, it's that building pipelines is tightly coupled with the infrastructure that runs the pipelines. One aspect of that is scaling up compute to meet the requirements dictated by the pipeline. But another aspect is that `npm ci` should not be run before submitting the pipeline code to Dagger, but after submitting the pipeline code to Dagger. Dagger should be responsible for running `npm ci`, just like Concourse was responsible for doing all the interpolation of the `((var))` syntax (i.e. you didn't need to run some kind of templating before submitting the YAML to Concourse). If Dagger is responsible for running `npm ci` (really, `pnpm install`), then it can maintain its own local pnpm store / pipeline dependency caching, which would be much faster, and overcome any shortcomings in the caching system of GitHub Actions or whatever else is triggering it.

> Imagine you live in a world where no part of the build has to repeat unless the changes actually impacted it. A world in which all builds happened with automatic parallelism. A world in which you could reproduce very reliably any part of the build on your laptop.

That sounds similar to https://concourse-ci.org/

I quite like it, but it never seemed to gain traction outside of Cloud Foundry.

I used Concourse[0] for a while. No real complaints, the visibility is nice but the functionality isn't anything new.

[0] https://concourse-ci.org/

We run https://concourse-ci.org/ on our own hardware at our office. (as a side note, running your own hardware, you realise just how abysmally slow most cloud servers are.)

Concourse: https://concourse-ci.org

We use https://concourse-ci.org/ at the moment and have been reasonably happy with it, however it only has support for linux containers at the moment, no windows containers. (MacOS doesn't have a containers primitive yet unfortunately)

Looks nice, I selfhosted https://github.com/wekan/wekan for a while, which is a MIT licensed heavily Trello-inspired alternative, does someone know both Wekan and Plankanban and can tell their differences?

Where can I get info, how to make required changes to get software running on s390x? For example, some software requires CPU-specific assembler code. I can not get some code to compile correctly:

https://github.com/wekan/wekan/wiki/s390x

Thanks for writing this.

I have added and removed about 4 million lines of code:

https://github.com/wekan/wekan/graphs/contributors

to WeKan Open Source kanban:

https://wekan.github.io

You are not dumb. It is normal to feel frustrated, when figuring out, step by step, how something works, and what to do. It is like labyrinth. Having enough breaks, taking a walk when needed, having enough coping skills or adding more of them, having patience to keep notes of what is current position in that rabbit hole. If some way does not work, try some other way.

It is always about the basics. Many programming languages change syntax often. Some dependencies change.

For example, when writing some for database export:

1) There was no working code examples at documentation

2) Google etc searches had old info, did not work

3) I did not find from source code how it did work

4) ChatGPT, Bing AI etc examples did not work

5) So I tried with trial and error, what is correct syntax, character by character

For some error messages, sometimes Google search shows somebody having same problem, or even a fix. But if not, it's about reading source code of the software.

But this works when code is available, like in Open Source.

If something is binary executeable, then there is need to decompile, read assembler, deobfuscate, etc. That means even more required, I have not gone there yet. That is why I use and develop FOSS, when it is possible to more easily fix something, when it is broken.

Hi Wekan,

looks cool but IHMO suffers from confusing documentation and onramp.

It took me multiple attempts, days apart, after initially stumbling upon this comment to get a better sense of it.

The project homepage (https://wekan.github.io/) stresses the different installers but at that point I didn't know if I want to install it or not.

Clicking on the Features link (https://wekan.github.io/#features) just takes you a few lines down on the same page which doesn't tell you much.

I tried to find a link to the Github repo but that wasn't obvious either. Eventually I stumbled upon it by following the Docs and API links at the bottom but those are very small and hidden compared to the rest of the content on the page.

From the Docs wiki there is a much better list of Features (https://github.com/wekan/wekan/wiki#:~:text=Calendar-,Featur...) that tells me more of what I was looking for.

However, I still don't know what database backends are supported or how configurable those are which I need to know in order to assess my backup strategy and how much work it will be for me to maintain this for our intranet site.

Thanks! I added issue about it:

https://github.com/wekan/wekan/issues/4930

Try to look at wekan. https://wekan.github.io/

Deck is very minimal and not really suited for anything beyond simple, personal stuff, in my opinion. As far as self-hosted, my favorite is still Kanboard, which has a lot of plugins and themes to choose from. Leantime is good too and a bit different. I also like Vikunja and Wekan.

Have a look at Kanboard. For Android it can be used with kandroid (available on F-Droid). There is also WeKan with official app on Google Play Store