pharo VS jscodeshift

Smalltalk (https://pharo.org/)

Smalltalk also did this. These days my impression is the most active tendril is https://pharo.org/.

What I find especially interesting about that relative to this Python distro is that the Pharo executable runs in a host OS (e.g. whatever your daily driver is) and can maintain different image files for different Pharo system states. So not only do you have the integrated language/OS (which is very cool on its own), but you also have something that feels like Docker containers.

And it even goes beyond containers because those image files really are the state of the system at the time they're saved, which means you can ask for that file in a bug report and get guaranteed bug reproduction, which is pretty incredible.

It is the initial alpha release end-user can test. It is a complete port from Pharo to Cuis-Smalltalk. Likely bugs will be find.

I've recently started learning Pharo^1 and I think there is a lot to like about it. It hurts to say as a Lisp and Emacs fan, but using the Pharo IDE feels like using Emacs/extending Emacs with Emacs Lisp, but somehow with a more tightly integrated language and environment. Being able to easily inspect the code related to the UI widgets, modify it and make changes on the fly are unlike anything I've experienced in other languages. I think a whole OS built on top of Smalltalk would be so cool and really play into the strengths of Smalltalk. I'm also amazed that SmallTalk had a lot of these IDE like features since before the 80s^2. I know there are a lot of issues with image based languages, and I admit I haven't been using one long enough to have experienced all the Gotcha, so what does HN think of Smalltalks and it's derivatives, and what are you all doing with them?

1. https://pharo.org/

2. https://youtu.be/uknEhXyZgsg?t=2366

Cool! I program for around 7 months in Pharo now at Yesplan [0]. We're hiring a devops engineer and a software engineer. While the Pharo website [1] avoids mentioning it, it's a Smalltalk descendant.

What I like about Pharo:

1. Programming in the debugger makes things feel much quicker

2. Evaluating expressions inside your code editor makes programming feel much quicker

3. The ability to quickly browse classes and methods makes programming feel much quicker (e.g. I type Date somewhere, select it, press CMD+B and now I browse the Date class).

Don't get me wrong, Pharo has downsides, especially when it comes to using it in production (IMO). With that said, the language feels fun to use! I definitely like it now as my first language for side projects as it is more graphical, more playful, and feels quicker for iterative development (e.g. when consuming APIs). It's why I wanted to learn it in the first place, it has shown me a different philosophy on how programmers interact with a programming language and IDE.

[0] https://yesplan.be/en/vacancies

[1] https://pharo.org

Of course, Alan Kay's Smalltalk 80 is for many the quintessential lost paradise of personal computing. Some modern descendants are Squeak, Pharo and Cuis. Then there's Lisp machines, or for something more Unix-like, there's Plan 9.. so many cool systems deprived of mass adoption for no good reason.

> You know, that "assembling things live in the sky" Lisp feeling (Yegge's phrase, not mine). The only other computation environment that is right there en par in flexibility and conveyance of the same trippy feeling is, of course, Emacs.

Do you know Pharo? The experience you describe is also typical in the Smalltalk family. See https://pharo.org/

Smalltalk could be used as the "ideal" tool (balance between Code & No-Code). It starts out with a simple graphical interface for doing everything, but it also encourages you to customize everything by modifying the underlying code. Of course, the disadvantage is that it's quite niche - very few people actually use it nowadays.

In Smalltalk there is no such thing as source files. Your program is an image which can be freely modified and dumped. Look at Pharo[1] which is a modern Smalltalk environment. You start it up and create classes in the IDE, but never do you create "source files".

[1] https://pharo.org/

A parser can have various applications in everyday life, and you probably use some parser daily. Babel, webpack, eslint, prettier, and jscodeshift. All of them, behind the scenes, run a parser that manipulates an Abstract Syntax Tree (AST) to do what you need - we'll talk about that later, don't worry.

OP: If this is an avenue you feel like entertaining, here are some nice codemod tools that could ease the transition for you: CodeQue, Subsecond, and the old standard jscodeshift.

If that isn't enough or you find issues with it, the current de-facto standard for codemods is jscodeshift. You'll write more code, but at least you only have to write it once.

Here is the pull request https://github.com/facebook/jscodeshift/pull/549

Those are important but tough problems!

1. I feel like codemods and a setup shell prompt are the best solution to this, but this looks different for each language (eg, in JS there is https://github.com/facebook/jscodeshift). I could make UI around that for listers to provide parts of the app that should replaced and buyers to provide values for it, but it could be quite a rabbit hole. This is actually why I show the README for the repos, so users can see if the setup steps are comprehensive before buying (for paid ones).

2. I agree atomic commits can help someone navigate a new codebase. In the same spirit as my response to #1, I don't feel confident I could enforce this, but I could surface the commits on the starter repo page so potential buyers could see if the author laid things out well.

Thanks for the ideas!

That's why I've been working on a tool that automatically upgrades major versions of libraries with breaking changes, the idea is to simplify the process and save developers time and effort by having a bank of transformers (using codemod & jscodeshift) and open source them:

JSCodeshift: A toolkit for running and writing codemods.

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jscodeshift