typescript-json-schema VS dhall-lang

Typescript to JSON Schema

For anyone using both TypeScript and JSON schemas, but wanting to use TypeScript as the source of truth, I highly recommend the following library: [ts-json-schema-generator](https://github.com/YousefED/typescript-json-schema).

It does exactly what it says in the box: turns your TypeScript `types` / `interface` into machine-readable JSON schemas.

The library has a few open issues (does not deal well with some edge cases of composing Omit<> on sum types, and does not support dynamic (const) keys), but compared to manually writing JSON schemas, it's been amazing!

There are a bunch of tools to generate JSON-schema from a TS codebase, ie https://github.com/YousefED/typescript-json-schema

Now that cool thing we wanted to do? This library does exactly that!

> For more complex cases I find myself wishing I could just turn Typescript into some kind of schema validation for JSON.

Not sure if this is what you're looking for, and whether it's powerful and expressive enough for your use case, but you can use typescript-json-schema¹ for this, and validate with eg ajv.

¹https://github.com/YousefED/typescript-json-schema

Use https://github.com/YousefED/typescript-json-schema to go from TS -> json schema

For what it's worth, thanks to TypeScript transformers (a feature baked into the compiler), one can create a transformer library that verifies an object is valid for any TypeScript type and conveys that information to the typechecker. And indeed, it's already been made. It allows to parse unknown into a given T. This is nice, because one can generate a JSON schema out of a TS type, for other languages/codebases to integrate safely.

This is why I originally started a project to convert ts to json schema; https://github.com/YousefED/typescript-json-schema (and also check out a good alternative https://github.com/vega/ts-json-schema-generator)

Typescript JSON schema

Fail to see how this is any different than Dhall (https://dhall-lang.org/) other than it produces plists too.

Kubernetes config is a decent example. I had ChatGPT generate a representative silly example -- the content doesn't matter so much as the structure:

https://gist.github.com/cstrahan/528b00cd5c3a22e3d8f057bb1a7...

Now consider 100s (if not 1000s) of such files.

I haven't given Pkl an in depth look yet, but I can say that the Industry Standard™ of "simple YAML" + string substitution (with delicate, error prone indentation -- since YAML is indentation sensitive) is easily beat by any of:

- https://jsonnet.org/

- https://nickel-lang.org/

- https://nixos.org/manual/nix/stable/language/index.html

- https://dhall-lang.org/

- (insert many more here, probably including Pkl)

There are underpowered languages / tools, that can only solve a problem for which they are intended poorly. But not all limited tools are like that.

Say, eBPF is prominently not Turing-complete, which allows to guarantee that a eBPF program terminates, and even how soon. Still eBPF is hugely useful in its area.

Or, say, regular expressions are limited to regular languages; in particular, they famously [1] cannot process recursive structures, like trees. Still tools like grep / ag / rg are mightily useful.

Yes, I agree that YAML is underpowered for proper k8s configuration! But it's also too powerful for its own good in other aspects [2]. I wish Google used Dhall [3] or their own purely functional config language (FCL? I already forgot the name) instead of YAML; sadly, they did not.

[1]: https://stackoverflow.com/a/1732454/223424

[2]: https://ruudvanasseldonk.com/2023/01/11/the-yaml-document-fr...

[3]: https://dhall-lang.org/

Dhall: Dhall is a programmable configuration language that combines features like JSON, functions, types, and import capabilities. Its style leans towards functional programming, so if you're familiar with functional-style languages such as Haskell, you might find Dhall to be quite intuitive.

I've been thinking along these lines but more 'strongly validated' than statically typed in the sense that you'd be better off being able to load the entire config and then produce a list of problems (and should be able to offer good editor support if done correctly).

Though https://dhall-lang.org/ demonstrates that you can statically type quite a lot of configuration to great advantage, which appears to be programmatically embeddable in multiple languages per https://docs.dhall-lang.org/howtos/How-to-integrate-Dhall.ht...

> Where practical is in the sense of an engineer (or in their terms, a CS practitioner),

Configuration processing. E.g. I'd like my yamls to be decidable, though I'd settle for guaranteed to halt[1].

[1] https://dhall-lang.org/

Maybe you'd like jsonnet: https://jsonnet.org/

I find it particularly useful for configurations that often have repeated boilerplate, like ansible playbooks or deploying a bunch of "similar-but" services to kubernetes (with https://tanka.dev).

Dhall is also quite interesting, with some tradeoffs: https://dhall-lang.org/

A few years ago I did a small comparison by re-implementing one of my simpler ansible playbooks: https://github.com/retzkek/ansible-dhall-jsonnet

And to checkout Dhall: https://dhall-lang.org/