webpki VS Ockam

Beyond that, various things like the ScyllaDB driver are using OpenSSL because WebPKI doesn't support validating connections to IP addresses (as opposed to DNS names) and RusTLS currently delegates to WebPKI.

There's a JIT framework in Rust: https://github.com/bytecodealliance/wasmtime

There's a library for doing full X.509 certificate parsing and verification: https://briansmith.org/rustdoc/webpki/

There's definitely some attempts at doing pure-Rust SSL, but I suspect a lot of them are also doing some sketchy things with crypto that shouldn't be trusted (getting constant-time stuff implemented properly is really challenging, and probably requires large amounts of assembly to guarantee correctness).

An issue was raised with webpki to support the IP addressees 5 years ago, and yet it's still not there. What do people use to overcome the fact that rustls can't do IP-based client connections because of it? My guess would be, they are switching to native-tls or openssl-tls.

Yes, rustls currently doesn't support certificates without hostnames (only an IP); this is actually an issue with the webpki crate, and work to solve it is ongoing (will hopefully land in a release in a few months or so).

> Bundling this set with Firefox

I love that they did that; it was actually my idea (https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=657228). I believe the list is pretty large and changes frequently and so they download it dynamically.

> short cut to a "Yes"

Do they really do that? That's awesome if so. Then they don't even need to ship the roots.

> I specifically don't like [...] saying "unknown issuer"

https://github.com/briansmith/webpki/issues/221

> If std::fs::File::open() gives me Result with an io:Error that claims "File not found" but the underlying OS file open actually failed due to a permission error, you can see why that's a problem right? Even if this hypothetical OS doesn't expose any specific errors, "File not found" is misleading.

A more accurate analogy: You ask to open "example.txt" without supplying the path, and there is no "example.txt" in the current working directory. You will get "file not found."

Regardless, I agree we could have a better name than UnknownIssuer for this error.

disclosure: I work at Ockam.

The Portals for Mac app is an example of the type of thing you could build using the open source stack of protocols. The README (linked by parent) links out to all of the relevant parts of the protocol documentation to explain how these work together. The NAT Traversal (https://github.com/build-trust/ockam/blob/develop/examples/a...) part of the README is probably the best explanation of why the free relay you get via Ockam Orchestrator is a useful part of this demo.

As for why would anyone trust this: The protocols are designed so you absolutely don't have to trust the relay. Trust is pushed out to the edges that you control and so you're not susceptible to a MITM attack if something like a relay is compromised. The protocol design for all of this is open and documented, and was independently audited by (IMO) some of the best in the business, Trail of Bits: https://docs.ockam.io/reference/protocols.

🚀 Portals for Mac – A macOS app built in Swift that uses the Ockam Rust library to privately share a service on your Mac with anyone, anywhere. The service is shared securely over an end-to-end encrypted and mutually authenticated Ockam Portal. Your friends will have access to it on their localhost! This app is a great example of the kinds of things you can build with Ockam 👉

Ockam is a suite of programming libraries, command line tools, and managed cloud services to orchestrate end-to-end encryption, mutual authentication, key management, credential management, and authorization policy enforcement — all at massive scale. Ockam's end-to-end secure channels guarantee authenticity, integrity, and confidentiality of all data-in-motion at the application layer.

We’ve been working on something (https://github.com/build-trust/ockam) that enables exactly this, among a whole host of other use cases. If you check out some of the code examples in the docs you’ll see how to setup a tunnel using the CLI.

For other use cases there’s also the programming libraries (only Rust atm, though I was spiking a TypeScript/Node PoC this week) which might provide more flexibility. Personally I’m excited by the idea of being able to move this kind of secure by design connectivity all the way into the application layer though.

If you're not already an active contributor to an open source project or two it can seem very daunting. You don't want to do the wrong thing and embarrass yourself. Remove that anxiety for people by giving them an easy way to do something low risk. Matt did that a couple of years ago by creating a long-lived issue for people to simply say hello. That's it. Say hi, introduce yourself. It's a safe place to make a first step.