niv VS anarki

niv

Flakes work. An alternative is niv which was once popular and provides a good developer experience.

Essentially you can just think of it as a standardized default.nix/shell.nix with built-in Niv integration.

I agree that the FP part is not the only issue. It's that the community feels a bit more academic/I'll fix this for myself in the way that works best for me.

You can indeed achieve some reproducibility with Docker. It's tricky though, as you'd have to pin exact package versions of software. If you'd `FROM ubuntu:$VERION`, and would run an `apt-get update`, you're not guaranteed to get the same software.

Nix is like ZFS, as that it breaks the wall between two previously distinct area's. Those being building software, and installing/configuration software on your OS. It's quite different from the snapshot-everything methodology that Docker uses. Yeah, one can split in multi-stage images etc, but than you'll be keeping track of which dependencies need to be moved between the stages yourself, in a manner that cannot be abstracted away, so you're doomed to repeat the same patterns over and over again.

People also state that LVM + ext3 is more than sufficient compared to the complexity of ZFS. They miss out on the fact on how much more fine grained solutions are possible with ZFS.

I've used niv [0] before flakes arrived, and am actually still using that instead of flakes. The experimental nature of them has scared me away from them, as I'm not daily involved in this ecosystem at the moment.

[0] https://github.com/nmattia/niv#niv

You can use something like Niv to manage additional sources. I use it to fetch some Emacs packages, for example ligature.el. Then you update the package using $ niv update.

One thing that made this easier was switching from using Nix channels to explicitly pinning my dependencies with Niv. I honestly never fully understood how channels worked, and it's just much nicer to have everything specified in my Git repo. The exact commit of Nixpkgs that I'm using is in my sources.json file, so "reverting" just means checking out an older commit of my configs from Git then running nixos-rebuild switch. If I were redoing my dotfiles today I'd probably use Nix Flakes rather than Niv, but I suspect that Niv is still an easier option to get started with.

Does someone know of a way to remove unused pinned packages via [niv](https://github.com/nmattia/niv)?

Pin nixpkgs, and version control it. If you're using flakes, then just version control the flake.lock alongside your configuration. If you're not using flakes, you can use niv to easily pin nipxkgs, at the expense of some boiler plate.

This... This is laughable. How do I install ruby 2.6.8? Oh, there's no ruby_2_6_8, because of course there isn't. And this could be difference between a secure system and all your base are belong to us.

And they call this reproducible builds?

And that's before getting into the ridiculous

--- start quote ---

All the software that we installed depends on the specific version of the nixpkgs channel that we installed on our system [whose only version is a commit hash in a git repo]

--- end quote ---

So you need an extra tool [2] for, quote, "painless dependencies for Nix projects."

Yes, sure. I'm definitely ditching my version managers in favor of this tool, that hasn't solved these issues in 18 years of its existence.

[1] https://search.nixos.org/packages?channel=21.05&from=0&size=...

[2] https://github.com/nmattia/niv

It still is a single single-core server, dang references it frequently when there's unusually high traffic [0]. And the language you're referring to is Arc [1]. They do have caching for not-logged-in users, historically done through nginx [2]. From other comments in this thread, it sounds like they just temporarily put Cloudflare in front of that single server to block a DDoS.

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38310213

[1] https://arclanguage.github.io/

[2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26473226

Slashdot, reddit, and HN are similar in that the source code was available. For HN, as part of arc under the Artistic license. All 3 abandoned public source code releases.

https://sourceforge.net/projects/slashcode/

https://github.com/arclanguage/anarki

https://github.com/reddit-archive/reddit

>Where is the HN source code right now? Free and Open?

Yes and no.

HN itself is running a proprietary fork of Arc Lisp, which you can find here[0]. The Arc maintainters don't take public PRs or feature requests, and HN itself has numerous changes to the codebase which aren't public for business reasons.

There is a public fork of Arc called Anarki[1] which has no direct connection to HN or Arc Lisp, and for which the community and development is... well... anarchic.

And given the general culture here around minimalism and stasis (not wanting to introduce new features for fear of entropy that would negatively affect the signal to noise ratio and push the site towards Eternal September) chances are it's not likely to happen.

But dang's email is at the bottom of the page if you want to ask him.

[0]http://arclanguage.org/

[1]https://github.com/arclanguage/anarki

The original version was open sourced (Perl artistic License) http://arclanguage.org/ There is an active fork in https://github.com/arclanguage/anarki but it's totally independent and the current conde in HN can be (very) different.

My guess is that it's very difficult to keep all the details of the secret sauce hidden. They change the details very often. For example the front page is ordered by points/time^1.6, but the 1.6 changes from time to time without notice (I think it was 1.8 for some time, perhaps it's 1.8 or something else now. Some people have analyzed the front page and got compatible results, but I don't remember the exponent they found and I'm too lazy to try).

You might find something useful here:

https://github.com/arclanguage/anarki/tree/master/apps/news

It was published in the public version of 2009 https://github.com/arclanguage/anarki/blob/9f2e1dd53b5b66bb4... Look for "contro-factor" (i.e. controversial-factor).

This is old code, and the mods make tweaks here and there without warning, so the details may have changed. (I'm not sure if gravity changed from 1.8 to 1.6 (???).)

I didn't test it personally, but it feels like HN is using something very similar. And there are a few black box analysis of the sorting of the front page that got similar results. Also, minimaxir is the kind of person that is probably running an script to use the HN API to verify the claims.

Absolutely. It's basically the "community version" of Paul Graham's Arc.

Not to mention arc/anarki (hn is/was written in arc - anarki comes with a "news" example app/forum):

https://github.com/arclanguage/anarki/tree/HEAD#readme

arc [1] / racket implimentation of demystifycpp might be able to provide something 'usable' at the command line / straight up web browser html file.

[1] : https://arclanguage.github.io/