nheko VS LibreSignal

Look at this, notice anything different? https://github.com/Nheko-Reborn/nheko/issues/new/choose

Nheko has been around for a number of years. Never used it myself though.

https://github.com/Nheko-Reborn/nheko

Matrix clients hit different than pretty much any other chat client I've use before. Theres multiple clients I've found like nheko, moments, element that are a pleasure to look at and smooth as hell. Even better you can have users use web services like Element Web to sign-up and chat. Its sick.

The Nheko flatpak is official. Just compare the source to the nightlies we build and upload to our nightly repo.

Like almost every client out there it has no support for e2ee. I was happy to find https://nheko-reborn.github.io (I'm a KDE user so Qt apps are preferred).

There's also FluffyChat or Nheko if Element is too heavy.

I probably wouldn't have guessed that `e.dataTransfer.items` gets cleared at the first await (since I'm not a proficient web developer), but I would've been extremely wary of this code in general. Additionally (not tied to async-await but race conditions in general), is `item.getAsFileSystemHandle()` a TOCTTOU vulnerability where the type of an item can change between folders and files and symlinks etc., while this code is running?

Rust's & vs. &mut system largely eliminates shared state hazards in both threading and asynchronity (&mut is exclusive/unaliased and can't be mutated by other threads or event loop jobs, and & is difficult and unidiomatic to mutate), though it doesn't solve async cancellation errors (https://carllerche.com/2021/06/17/six-ways-to-make-async-rus..., discussed at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27542504), or filesystem TOCTTOU (https://blog.rust-lang.org/2022/01/20/cve-2022-21658.html as well as user code).

Qt event loop reentrancy is fun(tm) as well. It looks like a blocking call, but spawns a nested event loop which can do anything (but rarely enough to lull you into a false sense of complacency), resulting in segfaults like https://github.com/Nheko-Reborn/nheko/issues/656 (workaround at https://github.com/Nheko-Reborn/nheko/commit/570d00b000bd558..., I didn't look into it). And Qt lacks "easy" await syntax and a framework based on calling red functions (though I didn't look into C++20 coroutines yet, perhaps https://www.qt.io/blog/asynchronous-apis-in-qt-6 or https://github.com/mhogomchungu/tasks or https://blog.blackquill.cc/asynchronous-qtquick-uis-and-thei...?).

>what does this mean?

Moxie (Signal's founder) has thrown fits in the past over the existence of third-party clients using their servers: https://github.com/libresignal/libresignal/issues/37#issueco...

0: https://github.com/libresignal/libresignal/issues/37

I push back when anyone recommends Signal because they are fundamentally not an open network.

OWS has historically been hostile to third party implementations outside of their clients. There are multiple unofficial options but the only one I've been looking at is the bridge with matrix, though setting up a matrix server just for this is likely overkill.

I have to say that I find him fascinating too, but there are a few things that raise my suspicion, but of course do not convict him of anything:

The way he is attacking this alternative Signal client and rules out interoperability:

https://github.com/LibreSignal/LibreSignal/issues/37#issueco...

Signal was a word before he decided to turn it into a brand.

The signal server source code repo was not updated for a year. Communication intransparent.

https://www.androidpolice.com/2021/04/06/it-looks-like-signa...

I am not even against crypto integration, but I found the choice of MobileCoin odd. Instead of integrating an existing privacy coin or working with the community, he decided to integrate MOB and to be one of their "advisors":

https://techcrunch.com/2018/04/24/mobilecoin-moxie-marlinspi...

https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/mobilecoin

Is that so surprising? Signal had always a hostile attitude to alternative clients. They have this weird disconnect of the new CEO saying they want to be available to as many people as possible and be a fully commited FOSS app, and then have no version on F-Droid (while Telegram has!) and actively fight alternative clients (see https://github.com/LibreSignal/LibreSignal/issues/37#issueco...)

Because of this hostility Signal is not a trustworthy organization at all.

LibreSignal existed before Moxie was like “no, don’t”: https://github.com/LibreSignal/LibreSignal

They have shut down third party clients, and resve the roght to continue that.

https://github.com/LibreSignal/LibreSignal/issues/37#issueco...

1) You need to audit that code, which.. everyone will have to do.

2) https://signal.org/blog/reproducible-android/

> the Signal Android codebase includes some native shared libraries that we employ for voice calls (WebRTC, etc). At the time this native code was added, there was no Gradle NDK support yet, so the shared libraries aren’t compiled with the project build.

a good answer in my opinion, but it means what you run from the play store is not reproducible and thus can never really be confirmed to be what the sources actually include. There are also binary blobs needed for interacting with Google Play.

3) Signal is openly hostile to third party client implementations: https://github.com/LibreSignal/LibreSignal/issues/37

Moxie Marlinspike on May 5th 2016:

> I'm not OK with LibreSignal using our servers, and I'm not OK with LibreSignal using the name "Signal." You're free to use our source code for whatever you would like under the terms of the license, but you're not entitled to use our name or the service that we run.

> If you think running servers is difficult and expensive (you're right), ask yourself why you feel entitled for us to run them for your product.

Moxie Marlinspike left Signal this January[2] 2022.

Whose to say whether there will be any change, but it's been interesting seeing Signal as a somewhat defended property. Although various third party clients/tools/libraries do exist already.

The claim that running servers is expensive would have been more interesting, imo, had there been any viable way to run your own. But for a long while Signal server source code wasn't being updated at all.

[1] https://github.com/LibreSignal/LibreSignal/issues/37#issueco...

[2] https://signal.org/blog/new-year-new-ceo/