msgspec VS simdjson

Full support for validation and serialisation of attrs classes and msgspec Structs. Where previously only Pydantic models and types where supported, you can now mix and match any of these three libraries. In addition to this, adding support for another modelling library has been greatly simplified with the new plugin architecture

> Maybe it was very slow before

That is at least partly the case. I maintain msgspec[1], another Python JSON validation library. Pydantic V1 was ~100x slower at encoding/decoding/validating JSON than msgspec, which was more a testament to Pydantic's performance issues than msgspec's speed. Pydantic V2 is definitely faster than V1, but it's still ~10x slower than msgspec, and up to 2x slower than other pure-python implementations like mashumaro.

Recent benchmark here: https://gist.github.com/jcrist/d62f450594164d284fbea957fd48b...

[1]: https://github.com/jcrist/msgspec

While it's definitely much faster than pydantic V1 (which is a huge accomplishment!), it's still not exactly what I'd call "fast".

I maintain msgspec (https://github.com/jcrist/msgspec), a serialization/validation library which provides similar functionality to pydantic. Recent benchmarks of pydantic V2 against msgspec show msgspec is still 15-30x faster at JSON encoding, and 6-15x faster at JSON decoding/validating.

Benchmark (and conversation with Samuel) here: https://gist.github.com/jcrist/d62f450594164d284fbea957fd48b...

This is not to diminish the work of the pydantic team! For many users pydantic will be more than fast enough, and is definitely a more feature-filled tool. It's a good library, and people will be happy using it! But pydantic is not the only tool in this space, and rubbing some rust on it doesn't necessarily make it "fast".

https://github.com/jcrist/msgspec so I am using this instead of Pydantic.

Another thing: why pyserde rather than stuff like msgspec? https://github.com/jcrist/msgspec

Try msgspec | Maat | turbo for fast serialization and validation

Congratulations to the team, Pydantic is an amazing library.

If you find JSON serialization/deserialization a bottleneck, another interesting library (with much less features) for Python is msgspec: https://github.com/jcrist/msgspec

This feature is yet to be released, but it will allow you to seamlessly use data modelled with for example Pydantic, SQLAlchemy, msgspec or dataclasses in your route handlers, without the need for an intermediary model; The conversion will be handled by the specific DTO "backend" implementation. This new paradigm also makes it trivial to add support for any such modelling library, by simply implementing an appropriate backend.

It's also supported by simdjson [0] (which has a lot of language bindings [1]):

> Multithreaded processing of gigantic Newline-Delimited JSON (ndjson) and related formats at 3.5 GB/s

[0] https://simdjson.org/

[0] https://github.com/simdjson/simdjson?tab=readme-ov-file#bind...

String parsing is negligible compared to the speed of the DOM which is glacially slow: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38835920

Come on, people, make an effort to learn how insanely fast computers are, and how insanely inefficient our software is.

String parsing can be done at gigabytes per second: https://github.com/simdjson/simdjson If you think that is the slowest operation in the browser, please find some resources that talk about what is actually happening in the browser?

Thanks for all the detailed information! That answers a bunch of my questions and the implementation of strlen is nice.

The instruction I was thinking of is pshufb. An example ‘weird’ use can be found for detecting white space in simdjson: https://github.com/simdjson/simdjson/blob/24b44309fb52c3e2c5...

This works as follows:

1. Observe that each ascii whitespace character ends with a different nibble.

2. Make some vector of 16 bytes which has the white space character whose final nibble is the index of the byte, or some other character with a different final nibble from the byte (eg first element is space =0x20, next could be eg 0xff but not 0xf1 as that ends in the same nibble as index)

3. For each block where you want to find white space, compute pcmpeqb(pshufb(whitespace, input), input). The rules of pshufb mean (a) non-ascii (ie bit 7 set) characters go to 0 so will compare false, (b) other characters are replaced with an element of whitespace according to their last nibble so will compare equal only if they are that whitespace character.

I’m not sure how easy it would be to do such tricks with vgather.vv. In particular, the length of the input doesn’t matter (could be longer) but the length of white space must be 16 bytes. I’m not sure how the whole vlen stuff interacts with tricks like this where you (a) require certain fixed lengths and (b) may have different lengths for tables and input vectors. (and indeed there might just be better ways, eg you could imagine an operation with a 256-bit register where you permute some vector of bytes by sign-extending the nth bit of the 256-bit register into the result where the input byte is n).

Additionally, if you like low level stuff, check out libfmt (https://github.com/fmtlib/fmt) - not a big project, not difficult to understand. Or something like simdjson (https://github.com/simdjson/simdjson).

Everything you said is totally reasonable. I'm a big fan of napkin math and theoretical upper bounds on performance.

simdjson (https://github.com/simdjson/simdjson) claims to fully parse JSON on the order of 3 GB/sec. Which is faster than OP's Go whitespace parsing! These tests are running on different hardware so it's not apples-to-apples.

The phrase "cannot go faster than this" is just begging for a "well ackshully". Which I hate to do. But the fact that there is an existence proof of Problem A running faster in C++ SIMD than OP's Probably B scalar Go is quite interesting and worth calling out imho. But I admit it doesn't change the rest of the post.

I have same question as /u/JDRiverRun : how do you deal with JSON, do you parse json on Rust side or on Emacs side. I see that you are requiring json.el in your lspce.el, but I haven't looked through entire file carefully. If you parse on Rust side, do you use simdjson (there are at least two Rust bindings to it)? If yes, what are your impressions, experiences compared to more "standard" json library?