interface-types
assemblyscript
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636 | 16,414 | |
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almost 2 years ago | 7 days ago | |
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interface-types
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WebAssembly Playground
Some things that might greatly increase wasm usage and overall tooling:
1) Tools that run docker containers and serverless function services (like AWS lambda) to support providing a .wasm files instead
2) Garbage collection in the runtime to make GC languages easier to port to wasm
3) Dynamically typed languages (NodeJS, Python, Ruby) being able to compile to webassembly directly instead of porting the runtime to webassembly and then running the code through the runtime. This is a big ask though, basically needs to redesign the runtime completely
4) wasm-DOM bindings will enable other languages to do HTML rendering which will require new web frameworks for every language that wants to take over the space from JS. This will lead to (even more) fragmentation of the web ecosystem
5) A new wasm-first SDK (unrelated to the DOM) for building cross platform applications. I can see this taking off only if it is built-into the browsers and backed by some standards committee, so not very likely I think
6) Something like the Interface Types proposal ( https://github.com/WebAssembly/interface-types/blob/main/pro... ) becomes a thing allowing wasm programs to be consisted of modules written in several different languages and being able to call said modules with low or 0 runtime performance hit (and of course, no compilation to multiple CPU archs). So much of programming ecosystems are locked to specific languages (like data science with python) when there is little technical reason for it be like that.
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Bring garbage collected programming languages efficiently to WebAssembly
AFAIK GC is irrelevant for "direct DOM access", you would rather want to hop into the following rabbit hole:
- reference types: https://github.com/WebAssembly/reference-types/blob/master/p...
- interface types (inactive): https://github.com/WebAssembly/interface-types/blob/main/pro...
- component model: https://github.com/WebAssembly/component-model
If this looks like a mess, that's because it is. Compared to that, the current solution to go through a Javascript shim doesn't look too bad IMHO.
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Plugins in Rust: Wrapping Up
Really good questions. Unfortunately, most of the issues I found back then were fundamental ones. I've seen that Wasm has deprecated "Interface Types" and is now working on the "Component Model". But even then, as far as I understand that would only avoid the serialization and deserialization steps, and you would still need to copy complex types. It will be more performant, but I don't think it would be enough for Tremor either.
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When moving from JS to WASM is not worth it - Zaplib post mortem
wasm doesn't know anything about the outside world on purpose. This allows it to be used in other domains. For direct access to the DOM et al, interface types are being developed. It's a non-trivial problem to interoperate with a dynamically typed GC'd language from any statically typed no-GC language that can compile to wasm.
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WebAssembly 2.0 Working Draft
The whole list of proposals and where they're at is here:
https://github.com/WebAssembly/proposals
You can see that "interface types" is at "Phase 1 - Feature Proposal (CG)", so still early days.
And there's a link to the proposal here, for people like me who don't know about it: https://github.com/WebAssembly/interface-types
You may want to look into WASM interface types, which is defining what amounts to am IDL for WASM and different languages have common calling conventions: https://hacks.mozilla.org/2019/08/webassembly-interface-type...
I don’t know if there’s a better intro article. I believe this is the current iteration of the proposal: https://github.com/WebAssembly/interface-types/blob/main/pro...
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Replace JS with Rust on front-end, possible? Advisable?
Yes, and if I'm not mistaken, this is the RFC
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Google Chrome emergency update fixes zero-day used in attacks
I see no reason why not. See the interface types proposal for a proposed solution.
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Front-end Rust framework performance prognosis
Wanted to get thoughts from the Rust experts on this - the author of the Yew framework seems to think that Web Assembly Interface Types (https://github.com/WebAssembly/interface-types/blob/master/proposals/interface-types/Explainer.md) will allow Yew to eventually become faster than Vue, React, Angular, etc. Is there general consensus on this in the Rust community? The prospect of mixing Rust (for the performance critical pieces) with TS on the front end doesn't seem super appealing to me.
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VSCode terminal from DOM to >canvas<
I can't help but feel like this is the worst. Every time we step away from HTML & the DOM & into a further farther reach of abstraction, into something custom crafted & artisinal, we lose our valuable common heritage. We flea from common understandability & recurse into something ever more unique & virtual.
In the process- as is the case with Google Docs[1]- we lose things like the ability for web extensions to work, if this is a web hosted vscode instance (vscode server, openvscode, code-server, others). Running a debugger against this part of vscode- web or native- now yields only garbage junk information.
Right now this is just the terminal. I think- "it could be worse". But it chills me deeply that the terminal is now no longer real information. It's now just a happenstance jumble of pixels, powered by only it's own inner logic & a unique maze of libraries. Big tech keeps optimizing and optimizing, & the motive we keep being sold- this is for your good, this helps you- is one I frankly have a very hard time negotiating with myself. De-webbifying the web, de-commonizing the common platform- as Facebook has done by virtualizing the DOM- feels like this ever-running big-bang from a truthful original universe into a sparse, cold, expanding universe where each little fragment defines itself, where the common hypertext medium no longer means anything.
I keep waiting for some moments of contraction, some coming back together, for things to make more sense again, to recontract into something more solid. React's first WebComponents PR[2] is a notable re-contracting, re-platforming- a powerful act I frankly didn't expect, so rare as to feel practically unprecedented.
I realize much of this flexibility, the demonstrated versatility of the web & usage of the various pieces of it represents much of it's strength. The platform being a low-level platform where higher level platforms can be created is amazing; the Extensible Web Manifesto[3] speaks to that emergence of newer higher levels systems. And right now we're in early days, just starting a precambrian explosion of higher level web, as technology like WebAssembly only just begins to become real- still so early, still way pre-pre- Interface Types[4]/Host Bindings, only just the crudest emulation beginning in via projects like Rust's wasm-bindgen / web-sys. I am happy we are still exploding. We have so much more to exlpore. But gee I also question so much when big enterprises turn hypertext into pixels. To move compute into webassembly is a bold leap but the hypertext can survive, the DOM is still truth. It's so uncertain to me, feels like so much might be lost when giants like Microsoft or Google yank out the HTML & replace it with pixels, pushed into our faces. It feels like betrayal, like sabotage, like we're giving up truth.
[1] https://workspaceupdates.googleblog.com/2021/05/Google-Docs-...
[2] https://github.com/facebook/react/pull/22184 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29505332 (16 days, 0 comments)
[3] https://github.com/extensibleweb/manifesto
[] https://github.com/WebAssembly/interface-types/blob/main/pro...
assemblyscript
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Let's Write a Malloc
Incidentally, it’s also what AssemblyScript uses: https://github.com/AssemblyScript/assemblyscript/blob/main/s...
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Gentle Introduction To Typescript Compiler API
Use it as a Front-End for other low-level languages.
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TypeScript Is Surprisingly OK for Compilers
> MHO typescript could just cut loose from its javascript compatibility. Why not compile it to wasm instead of transpiling it to javascript?
Check out AssemblyScript which is exactly that:
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Do you think typescript will ever have native support on brosers? Or we will have only the JS type annotations?
If you're curious, check out AssemblyScript, that might describe better what needs to be cut from TypeScript to make it possible to be compiled to WASM.
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Ezno's checker (a Javascript type checker and compiler written in Rust) is now open source
This is kinda the idea behind AssemblyScript, but IIRC it's more of a low-level typescript-ish syntax for WebAssembly.
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Emerging Rust GUI libraries in a WASM world
Exactly, WASM was designed to be very very lightweight... you can put a lot of logic into a very small amount of WASM, but you need a good compiler to do that, or write WASM by hand to really feel the benefit. If you just compile Go to WASM, with its GC, runtime and stdlib included in the binary, yeah it's going to be pretty heavy... Rust doesn't have a runtime but as you said, for some reason, produces relatively large binaries (not the case only in WASM by the way). Probably, the best ways to create small WASM binaries is to compile from C or from a WASM-native language like AssemblySCript (https://www.assemblyscript.org).
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Dan Abramov responds to React critics
Well we have all the new ECMA standards that will be introduced in 5 years now. It's looking more like Java actually. its accessor and typing patterns match it the most. TypeScript has had quite the profound influence over future ECMA design. There is a not so well known project called AssemblyScript which I think has a promising future. Since future ecma standards closely resembles it and TypeScripts popularity has exploded I have a feeling it may become a real standard as well.
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Do any engines or optimizers product TS-specific performance gains?
If you can guarantee that Typescript type hints will always be followed, you can turn it into more optimised code. Unfortunately, this means you've got to break Javascript semantics, so this means creating a new language, but people have done it. For example, AssemblyScript is a language that is designed as a strict subset of Typescript that compiles directly down to WebAssembly instead of Javascript, producing much more efficient code (most of the time). The tradeoff is that it has some slightly different semantics to Javascript, which means your existing codebase — and most of the libraries you use — will probably require some adaption before running correctly in AssemblyScript.
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Announcing TypeScript 5.0
If you have heard of WASM, AssemblyScript allows you to use specific integer/floating point types and I think it's cool that they're using TypeScript syntax.
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[AskJS] You have mastered writing JavaScript from scratch, why use TypeScript?
You can write the source code in C, C++, Rust, AssemblyScript, or something like this https://www.assemblyscript.org/.
What are some alternatives?
rust-ffmpeg-wasi - ffmpeg libraries precompiled for WebAsembly/WASI, as a Rust crate.
Lua - Lua is a powerful, efficient, lightweight, embeddable scripting language. It supports procedural programming, object-oriented programming, functional programming, data-driven programming, and data description.
ffmpeg.wasm - FFmpeg for browser, powered by WebAssembly
reference-types - Proposal for adding basic reference types (anyref)
rust - Empowering everyone to build reliable and efficient software.
deno - A modern runtime for JavaScript and TypeScript.
grain - The Grain compiler toolchain and CLI. Home of the modern web staple. 🌾
goscript - An alternative implementation of Golang specs, written in Rust for embedding or wrapping.
pyodide - Pyodide is a Python distribution for the browser and Node.js based on WebAssembly
gc - Branch of the spec repo scoped to discussion of GC integration in WebAssembly
ASP.NET Core - ASP.NET Core is a cross-platform .NET framework for building modern cloud-based web applications on Windows, Mac, or Linux.
RustPython - A Python Interpreter written in Rust