cranelift-jit-demo VS bevy

I'm working on a small stack-based programming language. I'm currently at a stage where I'm trying to compile it using Cranelift. Altrough the Cranelift documentation is extensive, I'm lacking a broader picture on how to approach some things like heap-allocations and stack-management. The only example project I found are cranelift-jit-demo and this wonderful post.

First, it's much easier than you think, I swear. I strongly suggest that you start with the cranelift JIT toy language demo, it has everything that you need to get started.

Fyi I've checked a few (from here; https://github.com/appcypher/awesome-wasm-langs): - assembly script complier is written is typescript/javascript and in theory could be compiled to wasm, and hence could be embedded, but it is only theory as noone has managed to complete this flow - rust-driver requires the linker and calls it as an external tool to link the rustcore to the user code. without the core lib i could not manage to create anything usable. - zig (somewhat similar to rust): on discord some experr said it cannot be embedded and he see no option/plan for it. - lua: they have lua runtime running in wasm, but no transpiller to wasm I've also checked a few other without any success and closest I coild get was the example language for cranelift (https://github.com/bytecodealliance/cranelift-jit-demo)

JITs are somehow more tricky and differ in the a few points including: a) Codegen is much more time critical. b) JITs must know what's allready generated and what isn't. c) JITs often rely on informations only generated at runtime and must respond to that. See here for a JIT example witten with cranelift: https://github.com/bytecodealliance/cranelift-jit-demo.

You could also try Cranelift. The resulting code isn't as optimized as with LLVM, but it's faster and pleasant to use (and is written in Rust).

Backend IRs for code generation: - Cranelift (see https://github.com/bytecodealliance/cranelift-jit-demo as well as the messages on the Zulip chat if you get stuck)

As for LLVM, I'm not sure if there are any tutorials but I would really advise writing a bytecode interpreter first, unless you already have some grasp of assembly. However, this repository: https://github.com/bytecodealliance/cranelift-jit-demo is really great for learning cranelift which is essentially an LLVM alternative.

It was mainly built for wasm compilation. So no it is not married to rust. https://github.com/bytecodealliance/cranelift-jit-demo

Missing one of the best choices as long as "maturity" isn't on the top of your list: Bevy - https://bevyengine.org/

Game engine written in Rust, leveraging ECS in almost every place and way, with a really capable WASM export option. Wrestling ECS for the first time might take you some time, but in my experience helps you keep game code as clean and decoupled as game code could be.

I don't see WASM/WebGPU changing anything when it comes to gaming, as an industry, personally. 3d visualizations and interactive websites? Yeah definitely a nice improvement over WebGL 2, if years late.

WebGPU is pretty far behind what AAA games are using even as of 6 years ago. There's extra overhead and security in the WebGPU spec that AAA games do not want. Browsers do not lend themselves to downloading 300gb of assets.

Additionally, indie devs aren't using Steam for the technical capabilities. It's purely about marketshare. Video games are a highly saturated market. The users are all on Steam, getting their recommendations from Steam, and buying games in Steam sales. Hence all the indie developers publish to Steam. I don't see a web browser being appealing as a platform, because there's no way for developers to advertise to users.

That's also only indie games. AAA games use their own launchers, because they don't _need_ the discoverability from being on Steam. So they don't, and avoid the fees. If anything users _want_ the Steam monopoly, because they like the platform, and hate the walled garden launchers from AAA companies.

(I work on high end rendering features for the Bevy game engine https://bevyengine.org, and have extensive experience with WebGPU)

I was working through an example in the repo for the Bevy game engine recently and came across this code

That's possible. I did spend quite a bit of time tinkering with compiler flags, and followed the recommendations.

Some notes I found just now seems to agree with my results, though: https://github.com/bevyengine/bevy/issues/3978#issuecomment-...

I cannot recommend immediate mode GUI programming based on the limitations I've experienced working with egui.

egui does not support putting two widgets in the center of the screen: https://github.com/emilk/egui/issues/3211

It's really easy to get started with immediate mode, it's really easy to bust out some UI, but the second you start trying to involve dynamically resized context and responsive layouts -- abandon all hope. The fact it has to calculate everything in a single pass makes these things hard/impossible.

... that said, I'm still using it for https://ant.care/ (https://github.com/MeoMix/symbiants) because it's the best thing I've found. I'm crossing my fingers that Bevy's UI story (or Kayak https://github.com/StarArawn/kayak_ui) become significantly more fleshed out sooner rather than later. Bevy 0.13 should have lots more in this area though (https://github.com/bevyengine/bevy/discussions/9538)

I've also been enjoying building My First Game™ in Bevy using ECS. The community around Bevy really shines, but Flecs (https://github.com/SanderMertens/flecs) is arguably a more mature, open-source ECS implementation. You don't get to write in Rust, though, which makes it less cool in my book :)

I'm not very proud of the code I've written because I've found writing a game to be much more confusing than building websites + backends, but, as the author notes, it certainly feels more elegant than OOP or globals given the context.

I'm building for WASM and Bevy's parallelism isn't supported in that context (yet? https://github.com/bevyengine/bevy/issues/4078), so the performance wins are just so-so. Sharing a thread with UI rendering suuucks.

If anyone wants to browse some code or ask questions, feel free! https://github.com/MeoMix/symbiants

These days, some game engines have done pretty well at making compute shaders easy to use (such as Bevy [1] -- disclaimer, I contribute to that engine). But telling the scientific/financial/etc. community that they need to run their code inside a game engine to get a decent experience is a hard sell. It's not a great situation compared to how easy it is on NVIDIA's stack.

[1]: https://github.com/bevyengine/bevy/blob/main/examples/shader...

This is the API you need: https://github.com/bevyengine/bevy/pull/9774