awesome-lisp-companies
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awesome-lisp-companies
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Why Is Common Lisp Not the Most Popular Programming Language?
Everyone, if you don't have a clue on how's Common Lisp going these days, I suggest:
https://lisp-journey.gitlab.io/blog/these-years-in-common-li... (https://www.reddit.com/r/lisp/comments/107oejk/these_years_i...)
A curated list of libraries: https://github.com/CodyReichert/awesome-cl
Some companies, the ones we hear about: https://github.com/azzamsa/awesome-lisp-companies/
and oh, some more editors besides Emacs or Vim: https://lispcookbook.github.io/cl-cookbook/editor-support.ht... (Atom/Pulsar support is good, VSCode support less so, Jetbrains one getting good, Lem is a modern Emacsy built in CL, Jupyter notebooks, cl-repl for a terminal REPL, etc)
yet no other language gives so many tools to the developer… quantum companies would disagree. https://github.com/azzamsa/awesome-lisp-companies/
(BTW: CL isn't Smalltalk which isn't uniquely that anymore, we do use source files and we can compile single-file binaries. My web app weights 35MB, starts up in 0.4s (or 0.01s without core compression))
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We need to talk about parentheses
Examples (for Common Lisp, so not citing Emacs): reddit v1, Google's ITA Software that powers airfare search engines (Kayak, Orbitz…), Postgres' pgloader (http://pgloader.io/), which was re-written from Python to Common Lisp, Opus Modus for music composition, the Maxima CAS, PTC 3D designer CAD software (used by big brands worldwide), Grammarly, Mirai, the 3D editor that designed Gollum's face, the ScoreCloud app that lets you whistle or play an instrument and get the music score,
but also the ACL2 theorem prover, used in the industry since the 90s, NASA's PVS provers and SPIKE scheduler used for Hubble and JWT, many companies in Quantum Computing, companies like SISCOG, who plans the transportation systems of european metropolis' underground since the 80s, Ravenpack who's into big-data analysis for financial services (they might be hiring), Keepit (https://www.keepit.com/), Pocket Change (Japan, https://www.pocket-change.jp/en/), the new Feetr in trading (https://feetr.io/, you can search HN), Airbus, Alstom, Planisware (https://planisware.com),
or also the open-source screenshotbot (https://screenshotbot.io), the Kandria game (https://kandria.com/),
and the companies in https://github.com/azzamsa/awesome-lisp-companies and on LispWorks and Allegro's Success Stories.
https://github.com/tamurashingo/reddit1.0/
https://www.ptc.com/en/products/cad/3d-design
https://apps.apple.com/us/app/scorecloud-express/id566535238
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A Tour of Lisps
Haven't had a lisp job, so maybe I shouldn't comment, but... I did use CL and Clojure on the job for a few things at my last two places. It's easier to find Clojure companies (and them to find you) than Common Lisp ones. You might want to peruse https://github.com/azzamsa/awesome-lisp-companies from time to time and see if any have openings. There's other resources linked too and of course there's the reddit and discord community (such as there is) hubs. You can also see if there are any meetups in your area, that's how I almost ended up at a Clojure startup some years back.
I should have taken strategy notes after talking to a guy at my last job who got management buy-in to rewrite a lot of Java code (for android) to Kotlin and have all new code for android be in Kotlin (before that was considered the sensible default). I think that's in general a better approach for a lot of would-be paid lispers: don't wait for or look for the lisp job, make the lisp job. Whether that's doing work where the customer doesn't care what language the thing is made in, or introducing it (some have even snuck it in -- the original clojure.jar got a lot of early success that way) to an existing work place. What I somewhat remember from my conversation was that if you can make a good technical case and have at least one other person supporting you (ideally your entire dev team as was his case), it's a lot easier to sell. No one raised bogus concerns about increasing the hiring difficulty or effort learning the new system. (I say bogus because engineers are learning all the time, and huge swathes of the industry have already had to do things like migrate from ObjC to Swift, or the various versions of JavaScript and later TypeScript + all the framework churn, switching IDEs; learning and change are quite common and a non-issue.) From other Lisp company reports, getting a new hire up to speed to be productive with the team using Common Lisp is a matter of a week or two, a small portion of the overall onboarding time a lot of new jobs have. Mastery takes longer, of course, but that's different.
If I had stayed longer at my last job I would have continued to flesh out a better demo for interactive selenium webdriver tests for our main Java application after injecting ABCL into it, it seemed like the easiest vector to get more interest from my team and other teams. It kind of sucks when you're debugging a broken test and finally hit an exception but now you have to start over again (especially if you stepped too far in the debugger), especially with heavy webdriver tests that can take a long time. The Lisp debugging experience is so much better... And when writing the test from scratch, it's very interactive, you type code and execute it and verify the browser did what you intended. When you're done you run it again from scratch to verify.
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All of Mark Watson's Lisp Books
> but there doesn't seem to be one that really stands out as pragmatic, industrial
disagree ;) This industrial language is Common Lisp.
Some industrial uses:
- http://www.lispworks.com/success-stories/index.html
- https://github.com/azzamsa/awesome-lisp-companies/
- https://lisp-lang.org/success/
Example companies: Intel's programmable chips, the ACL2 theorem prover (https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rsta.2015.039...), urban transportation planning systems (SISCOG), Quantum Computing (HRL Labs, Rigetti…), big data financial analysis (Ravenpack, they might be hiring), Google, Boeing, the NASA, etc.
ps: Python competing? strong disagree^^
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Steel Bank Common Lisp
Hey there, newer member of the first group here. Please see https://github.com/azzamsa/awesome-lisp-companies/ to update your meta-comment. So, is CL used in the industry today, yes or no?
Personal note: I much prefer to maintain a long-living software in Common Lisp rather than in Python, thank you very much. May all the new programmers learn easily and all the teams have lots of ~~burden~~ work with Python, good for them.
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Racket: The Lisp for the Modern Day
Common Lisp has many industrial uses though.
(https://github.com/azzamsa/awesome-lisp-companies/
https://lisp-lang.org/success/
http://www.lispworks.com/success-stories/index.html
such as
https://www.cs.utexas.edu/users/moore/acl2/ (theorem prover used by big corp©)
https://allegrograph.com/press_room/barefoot-networks-uses-f... (Intel programmable chip)
quantum compilers https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32741928
etc, etc, etc)
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Why Lisp Syntax Works
A few more that we know of, using CL today: https://github.com/azzamsa/awesome-lisp-companies/
Others: https://lisp-lang.org/success/
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How to Understand and Use Common Lisp
yes
https://github.com/azzamsa/awesome-lisp-companies
industrial theorem prover, design of Intel chips, quantum compilers...
and little me, being more productive and having more fun than with python to deploy boring tools (read a DB, format the data, send to FTP servers, show a web interface...).
paip-lisp
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Ask HN: Guide for Implementing Common Lisp
PAIP by Peter Norvig, Chapter 23, Compiling Lisp
https://github.com/norvig/paip-lisp/blob/main/docs/chapter23...
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Towards a New SymPy
Sounds like a great project idea to make a toy demo of this direction you'd like to see. Maybe comparable to https://github.com/norvig/paip-lisp/blob/main/docs/chapter15... and https://github.com/norvig/paip-lisp/blob/main/docs/chapter8.... which are a few hundred lines of Lisp each, but do enough to be interesting.
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A few newbie questions about lisp
You could look into Paradigms of AI Programming by Peter Norvig which might interest you regardless of Lisp content.
- Peter Norvig – Paradigms of AI Programming Case Studies in Common Lisp
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A lispy book on databases
Origen: Conversación con Bing, 4/4/2023(1) gigamonkey/monkeylib-binary-data - GitHub. https://github.com/gigamonkey/monkeylib-binary-data Con acceso 4/4/2023. (2) paip-lisp/chapter4.md at main · norvig/paip-lisp · GitHub. https://github.com/norvig/paip-lisp/blob/main/docs/chapter4.md Con acceso 4/4/2023. (3) bibliography.md · GitHub. https://gist.github.com/gigamonkey/6151820 Con acceso 4/4/2023.
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sbcl and Let Over Lambda
Worth mentioning it is on github with corrected code (I've already run into mistakes in the printed version) https://github.com/norvig/paip-lisp
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The Janet Language
Reading Peter Norvig's PAIP (https://github.com/norvig/paip-lisp) in 1998 totally blew my mind. It completely changed how I think about programming in every other language I use(d). I love it still, and always will. And yes, my experience is the same as yours: learning lisp made me a better programmer in every other language I use (especially -- but not only -- Python).
The simplicity and symmetry of the syntax is a big part of that love for me. Being able to manipulate lisp code as lisp data, using the full power of the language to do so, is just brilliant.
Janet looks lovely! Looking forward to the book.
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How exactly would you go about writing a program to simplify algebraic expressions?
PAIP has some chapters on this. Here is one: https://github.com/norvig/paip-lisp/blob/main/docs/chapter8.md
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A Few Examples of Lisp Code Typography
For Common Lisp, there are several free books available:
- Practical Common Lisp (aimed at people who know how to program in a more mainstream language already) [1]
- Paradigms in Artificial Intelligence Programming (my personal favorite) [2]
- Common Lisp: A Gentle Introduction to Symbolic Computation (aimed at absolute beginners of programming) [3]
I highly recommend the r/lisp reddit community. Reddit as a platform has its issues, but the (Common) Lisp community there is very responsive and very helpful.
Lastly, you might be interested in checking out a game written entirely in Common Lisp, to be released imminently on Steam. It's called Kandria, and it's effectively 100% Lisp. [4]
[1] https://gigamonkeys.com/book/
[2] https://github.com/norvig/paip-lisp
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Common Lisp vs Racket
https://github.com/norvig/paip-lisp - Peter Norvig's Paradigm's of AI Programming
https://github.com/norvig/paip-lisp/search?l=Markdown&q=defm... - all references to defmacro in the markdown files
Chapter 3 shows a simple macro, just adding a while loop to the language.
Chapter 9 shows some more complex ones, including a with- macro and a grammar compiler macro.
Chapters 11 and 12 show the development of a Prolog implementation in CL using defmacro to aid in compilation again in Chapter 11.
Chapter 12 shows adding an OO system to the language. Technically not needed with CLOS, but a good demonstration of what can be done with macros.
There are other examples (why I included that search link). Macros let you change the language in ways large and small. Many uses could probably be replaced with functions, though you'd end up having to throw a bunch of quotes about or closures in order to delay processing things.
What are some alternatives?
Carp - A statically typed lisp, without a GC, for real-time applications.
mal - mal - Make a Lisp
portacle - A portable common lisp development environment
julia - The Julia Programming Language
30-days-of-elixir - A walk through the Elixir language in 30 exercises.
coalton - Coalton is an efficient, statically typed functional programming language that supercharges Common Lisp.
Fennel - Lua Lisp Language
Crafting Interpreters - Repository for the book "Crafting Interpreters"
picolisp-by-example - The source code of the free book "PicoLisp by Example"
slime - The Superior Lisp Interaction Mode for Emacs
common-lisp-by-example - Repo for Common Lisp by Example [Moved to: https://github.com/ashok-khanna/lisp-notes]